I have to admit, my first thought after getting my results was that since the test is new an error had been made. My plan now is that when TSK and GCR tests are ready, I’ll run a full panel so VPI gets another test. VPI would give me the most options on adding other morphs to the project. At this point my need to know if far greater than a need for any one answer to be the right one.
4 Likes
Breeder confirmed that he never crossed his leopard into his pied stuff, so it’s been a wild ride.
Doesn’t help that it came from my dinker banana boy 
5 Likes
Excellent plan. However, you might want to reach out to RGI as recent podcasts lead me to believe they might really slow down adding new genes to the already large panel. Apparently they have had some panel failures due to new genes being added so if I understand right you might start seeing new genes added as individual tests a good while before you see them included in the panel.
I’m sure false negatives could happen but I’m hoping it’s pretty rare.
Especially if Dr Morrill is able to confirm that MJ axanthic is the same as the GCR axanthic test being developed I really think that is your best next test. MJ must have been floating around in some of the very early pied projects to be in the Markus Jane collection mature pied project animals by 2008. I wasn’t able to find a thread confirming if his unexpected het MJ axanthic pair was known to be related or not. If not then it would seem likely one of the very first pied project pairings included an MJ axanthic het and plenty of time for the gene to be sprinkled throughout pied projects 20+ years later.
3 Likes
If you bought either snake @mcgoveran from Justin over at Kinova then it’ll be the MJ line.
edit; Looking at your two axanthics, I would put money on it being MJ based on the grey color.
There’s always a subtle difference between axanthics and MJs has a dusty silverish grey (imo)
6 Likes
I’m not trying to burst your bubble here, but the odds of this being a new morph are orders of magnitude slimmer than the odds of this being an established axanthic line. Even the rarer axathanthic lines have been established for years, and people buy and sell hets and pos hets all the time, some end up on craigslist, are mislabeled, people lose the paperwork, etc. Unexpected recessive traits (and even subtle incomplete dominant traits) do pop up sometimes as a result. I would be willing to bet good money on this being being one of the extablished lines of axanthic.
In order for this to be a new line it would mean that (A) this variant has been circulating within captive ball pythons at a frequency that’s low enough that no one else has managed to breed two hets together yet despite the thousands upon thousands of pairings that are made yearly, but somehow you managed to be the only one to breed two together and get a phentoype or (B) both parents have a germline de novo mutation at the exact same locus out of millions of base pairs and when bred together produce a recessive phenotype. It’s just too unlikely when we know that plenty of hets and pos hets are floating around there unlabeled.
While the one is definitely a paradox, the other two look full visual. Giving the other other babies 66% of being hets just like any other het to het pairing
6 Likes
Neither came from Justin.
When looking at the colors keep in mind that Blackhead and Enchi are both in the pairing. IMO, #1 has Enchi, #2 has Blackhead and Enchi, and #4 has Blackhead. I’m unsure if this is causing what you are seeing colorwise.
I appreciate your expert opinion and your time on this more than you know. I may have worded things like a statement, but trust me it was a question. I see ALL possibilities on this being low odds.
I was thinking that if the VPI test is 99.5% accurate, that .5% MAY still be a higher likelihood in this case than any of the other possibilities, except TSK. Again, just thinking out loud.
4 Likes
In my mind it would most likely be the MJ line. Wherever his line came from it was found in pied. I have a friend who only breeds pieds have MJ Ax pop up in his collection and none of the snakes it came from can be tied back to Mark although it’s possible some could be tied to Justin.
7 Likes
If it proves to be MJ, I wouldn’t be upset about that. 
However, unless GCR is proven to be the same as MJ, my only shot at proving it in the near future is to pair to a known MJ. I think we are just a few weeks away or less from a TSK and GCR test.
3 Likes
It looks MJ to me. I would reach out to Rich McColl Serpents on IG and show him some photos.
7 Likes
One of the recent RGI podcasts Dr Morrill mentioned there are people who think MJ and GCR are the same so he was planning to run the GCR test on some MJ samples. So maybe an answer Tuesday.
5 Likes
That’s what I’m hoping to hear about.
4 Likes
Thank god I’m not the only one to see that 
6 Likes
If I remember right, when Leopard was first identified it was assumed that it was connected to Pied in some way. Now that it’s been isolated and we have Leopard animals that aren’t Pied or het Pied, we know better. Is it a fair hypothesis to posit that Leopard and MJ Axanthic are likely located very close to Pied and that’s why they traveled together genetically with a high frequency?
2 Likes
I suspect it was just random that MJ axanthic just happened to be in a pied project. Dr. Morrill indicated the GCR test is looking good but I didn’t hear him say if the MJ samples hit on the GCR test or not. Once he has a good MJ test he should be able to say if it’s near pied or even on same chromosome or not.
4 Likes
Yeah, I noticed that as well. I’m hoping that GCR and MJ are in fact the same and that their tests will be available soon, as well as TSK. If all that happens I will test again for all of them including a retest for VPI. That should provide answers or at least fill in some missing pieces.
3 Likes