If you don’t know me, I’m C, I am currently a low-level herp keeper, with 1 leo, 1 chilean rose tarantula, a dwindling group of hermit crabs, land snails, and un-identified tadpoles.
However, my plan within the next 5 years or so (I am 20 and in college, so I need a job and stable home environment before adopting more beasties) is to expand my collection to include:
A single BCI (likely a male)
A single ABW tegu (weighing pros/cons of both sexes)
1-3 Ball Pythons
A variable collection of crested geckos
Now I am in no way looking to be a large scale breeder, I would never breed boas, tegus, or balls because of large clutch sizes that may be hard to move to ethical homes, etc.
HOWEVER, I have for about 18 months now been interested and researching breeding cresties for these reasons:
Low clutch rate (2 eggs per clutch ish, so perhaps up to 6-8 hatchlings per season, depending on viability, possible sperm retention for another season)
I LOVE THEM
Lovely variety of morphs
So I may very well just get a male and female I enjoy, pair them, and keep all the offspring bc I get too attached, but my question lies within:
IF I would ever want/need to sell crestie hatchlings, is this even viable as an unknown breeder on MM? The markets for several species (BP, cresties, beardies) are very oversaturated, and all known morphs are covered by more knowledgable and popular big breeders.
So is it possible to enter the market as a small scale breeder? Or is it best I go into the project knowing I’ll need to keep any and all offspring I’d produce?
Breeder here of cresties
So depending on Cresties you what to work with will depend on if it’s worth you getting into it, as, as you’ve said. They’re everywhere now.
It’s a bit of an issue especially when you have males to sell, they are hard to find homes for.
I’ll get some pics of the current family here in a bit!
My current morphs of interest are super dal, lavendar, tiger/yellow brindle.
Super dal I like to see on its own, I generally prefer a lavendar or brindle not have the added chaos so they can shine on their own. I also really like the blushing gene, and would love to work with good sized head structure and very solid crowns/crests.
Pet Pictures Tax! Including the doggo I didn’t mention for not being a herp, but she was offended she was left out.
Dog- Olive Oil (australian sheepdog and standard poodle mix, full of loud emotions)
Leo- Gak, unknown morph, rescued from a school program 8 years ago (hence the lack of toes)
T- Philly Girl, rescued from the same program
Hermie- Kirby (blue shell), the last of the 5 hermies rescued from the program, all were named for vacuum cleaners [pictured with Hoover, who passed about 3 weeks ago]
Snails- Bo and Ralphie, stinky little dudes
Isopods- I have a colony of 3 types (zebras, greek silver, Ohio common)
Tadpoles- fun mystery rescue from a local pet store
Lovely mix there, I work with super dals and lavenders too. That’s something people do like, and tigers/brindles also amazing.
If you keep them all pure and make sure your lavs are lavs I think you’ll do just fine!
I hope someday to be able to produce something splendid, even if I happen to be the only one who thinks so. I’m so excited to start, and it kills me that now just isn’t the right time.
But I have to think of the critters first, and if I’m not able to get them big enriching enclosures yet and not able to safely say there will be limited stress from a ton of house moves…well its not time.
So I sort of cut my teeth in the business side of things with breeding cresties circa 2016 and the biggest thing I noticed was the gap between “pet quality” and “breeder quality” geckos. Frankly, I hate that people put live animals into two categories that subjectively deem them worthy of one or the other. Having said that if you do put some effort and money into choosing really nice breeders then you’re going to end up with nice babies.
I heard a similar thing when I started breeding them of “oh the market is flooded so people shouldn’t get into breeding cresties” but the funny thing about that is, is that same flooded market didn’t stop the people who were saying it was flooded from continuing to breed them…Yes there are a TON of people breeding cresteds but there is also a reason they’re so popular as pets. Folks say the same thing about flooded markets with balls and we all see how that hasn’t slowed those down.
If you’re thinking of just doing something on the side with a few breeders then I say go for it just be selective about your breeders and projects. I also recommend producing only what you’re comfortable with keeping (numbers wise) and go into it with the mindset that you are likely going to be taking care of babies indefinitely (this may or may not be the case but it’s better to err on the more conservative side).
Most importantly: ENJOY it and breed what YOU want to breed not what is in fashion at the given point in time.
I appreciate the nice ramble 100% and I think you make very good points.
I think ultimately that would be my aim: find a nice male and female, breed them a single time just for my own collection, and if I get anything extra special or something someone wants to purchase, I’ll go from there.
I just didn’t want to risk even a single breeding season if the sale of even a single baby would be near impossible due to market saturation.
I do not breed cresties, but i will add a little of my 2 cents. If you are US based, we are currently going through a large recession and peoples spending money is lower than it once was due to inflation. So please keep in mind a few things:
Startup costs are going to be higher than they once were, food costs, bedding, etc.
The number of people capable of buying them has gone down.
Shipping prices are going up because of gas prices.
You would be going into it with no reputation, and are less likely to get sales unless your animals are really cheap, or really stand out.
So, it is logistically possible, and im sure you could find them homes, but i believe the reality of the situation is you are going to need to find buyers locally and will be sitting on them for a while.
This is not guaranteed, and if you produce high quality animals, the shipping costs may be worth it for buyers and you may be able to broaden your market, but if its hobby breeding cheaper animals, expect many wont find the shipping cost to be worth it even if the animal price is.
If you are doing it for fun and not profit, just take it slow and ensure all babies have a home before your next pairing
This isnt me trying to scare you away, ive just seen in the forums people who started up right before the recession having issues moving their animals, and i want to be temper optimism with realistic expectations. Its still doable, just have a plan to overcome these hurdles
No, I really appreciate it! Blunt answers are exactly what I needed, you certainly aren’t scaring me away. I’d rather act for the animals’ benefit, and if the chances for moving to new homes is low, its simply more ethical for me not to breed, or to be 100% prepared to keep and raise every single offspring I hatch.
These inputs are all very valuable, and I appreciate all the advice. I really appreciate everyone not simply giving me the greenlight or sugar coating it, bc realism will help both me and my future animals.
Of course! It isnt fair to you or your animals if we simply said what we thought you wanted to hear sometimes the best advice you can give a new breeder is the hard truth, it challenges them to overcome them, and gives them time to prepare solutions and get in the right mindset. If you are expecting sunshines and rainbows, then adversity may cause somebody to give up, but if you go into it expecting and preparing for the worst, then anything better than that is great, and if it comes to pass, you are fully prepared
EXACTLY my thought, which is why I have a section in my research notes about how to ethically and painlessly cull offspring with fatal birth deformities BEFORE I have my pictures of the morphs and babies I want to work with.
Its rough, but if I wanna take responsibility for breeding I have to take ALL the responsibility even the ugly parts, which was the main reason for this question post.
I want to be as aware as possible before I even consider bringing baby lizards into existence, since they will rely on human care their whole lives, no exceptions.
I no longer breed cresteds because I wanted to get back to focusing on snakes but I’ll say I was really burnt out by the time I got out of them. The last season I bred them, I got overzealous and bred pretty much all my crested females and it quickly ate up a lot of hours in my week. It’s not until a large chunk of your days off are used cleaning and feeding that you realize you’ve over done it. It only compounds when you’ve got multiple females dropping two eggs once a month for a majority of the year
Yeah I can see how that becomes an issue FAST.
Thats why I think I’ll just stick to one pairing, even though the eggs per clutch is small, those clutches just keep comin!
And yeah, you don’t HAVE to incubate every egg that is laid, but that makes me feel sad (not commenting in any way on the morality of that, nor shaming anyone who chooses this route for various reasons)
All ours are in bio vivs, literally nothing to clean but the glass. The clean up crew does the rest.
And feeding them doesn’t take too long Either realistically.
And digging for eggs, again a quick thing!
Plus the babies faces make feeding even more fun
We have multiple females laying, and will have more again next year with the holdbacks being ready to go next year. It doesn’t take a large amount of my time being with them or doing things for them. I also have royals, fat tails, a toad, dart frogs, day geckos, an Ackie, a short tail putting, a Leo, 3 dogs, a rat, 2 tortoises… Koi fish if they count too.
None of them take a huge chunk… maybe I’m used to it but I don’t find it takes a lot of time at all. I also have a daughter too
They can incubate at room temp. Which is what I do here. Don’t need to do anything but remove and put into tubs.
If you don’t want eggs anymore, I don’t agree with ‘killing’ them if they’re fertile. I knew someone who would freeze them. Don’t see the point… don’t pair them if you don’t want to care for them…
Simply give them to someone who’s near with cresties or hatch them and find homes.
Females can hold sperm for around 3 years, not all do but they can. So if that’s the case you’ll have 3 years of babies.
Something to think about… two high quality parents arent necessarily going to produce high quality offspring. Like a paradox, you cant breed that. High quality is by chance. Oh you can think its high quality all you want. That dont make it high quality. You can get high quality out of two mediocre parents. The over saturation of breeders isnt all you think. Most of it is just a popularity contest. People buy from them, and say look i bought this from so and so, hes popular, so that makes this high quality. Maybe in their own mind it does. But, if you can get past past these popular breeders that only sell to pay for a sports car, or mansion, or vacation, then youll be good. But, dont believe them when they say theyre in it for a hobby or love of reptiles, cuz thats a load of cr*p.
