What are some of the most chill venomous snakes out there? (medium venom) I really want to keep some hots at some point, and would really like to plan ahead. Another question. Are there any cobras out there that look cool yet aren’t, well, really aggressive? I (might) breed them and donate to a venom lab. A friend of mine knows someone who works at a venom lab.
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Heads up (or 6 feet down if you mess up bad enough), venomous snakes are not very fun for most people. You cannot handle them, and I do not care what anyone on YouTube says or does you cannot free handle venomous animals.
There is no such thing as a beginner venomous. Honestly you probably shouldn’t even be considering it until you have at least a few thousand hours of experience under the mentorship of someone who knows what they are doing. The best place to start AFTER you have experience working with them and preferably have kept some more smiley, active snakes like some oldworld rat snakes, is usually going to be something native. when something goes wrong (there is no if, just a when) it helps when hospitals are more familiar with what to do. Most hospitals wont even know what something like a rhino viper is, while everyone knows what a copperhead is and chances are a lot higher that you will get proper treatment quicker.
@ballornothing keeps some so hots hopefully he will see this and be able to add to/correct what I’ve said
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I second everything @logar Logan stated in his post. Venomous animals should be number 1, respected, and number 2, not handled by a novice or even an intermediate, but only by an Expert with a capital E.
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I “third” all of that.
Start with nonvenomous animals and gain years -yes, years- of solid experience working with them first. Don’t think of getting hots because you think they’re cool, without doing the solid research on what it takes to keep them safely and successfully.
Lose that idea completely. It doesn’t matter how calm a species is when it’s in its safe environs because venomous snakes should not be handled. Exception only for real experts and things like veterinary care. People doing freehandling of hots are behaving recklessly and make it harder for responsible keepers to be respected and treated fairly. The general public reacts with completely appropriate alarm, then the public is easily led into reacting much too broadly with rules and laws against all exotic animals.
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Something folks don’t often think of, when going down this road.
I had a good friend that had several very spicy snakes. Then one day he found out he was going to be a dad. To twins.
And he decided that he didn’t want to keep snakes that could inevitably kill him. And then he started looking for people and places that wanted his snakes. Took him close to 18 months to get all 6 of his hots to new owners. And three of those went to zoos. Yeah, he lost quite a bit of money as well.
So aside from all of the great posts above, think about what you will do if for some reason, you decide you don’t want killer hipless friends.
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Another thing to keep in mind is that any significant mistake you make while keeping hots will likely not only impact you, but others as well. There have been far too many cases where someone’s reckless/neglectful behavior, or other lack of care and oversight have caused significant grief for all venomous keepers, and led to bans on keeping.
Before you even think about keeping anything, you need to know the ins and outs of your local laws. If you’re in the US, that’s not only state laws, but also county & city ordinances, etc. You will need to check into any permits and licensing, and they may require that you have liability insurance. You will need to know about proper containment, labeling, handling, etc. You will need to own your own home and be aware that any homeowner’s insurance policy could be cancelled due to the animals you keep.
Realistically, the vast majority of people are not competent enough to properly keep hots, and anyone trying to do so because they think something is “cool” is highly irresponsible. If you must own something venomous, go with something considered “mildly” venomous and more commonly kept, such as Boiga, before even thinking about jumping into the deep end.
As for this:
False Water Cobra, even though it is not an actual cobra. Not going to kill you (unless you’re allergic), still very cool animals, can be safely handled.
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Another great point.
Unless you’re allergic
You can have an adverse reaction to any venom. Not just mid or high.
Someone recently was bit by their gila monster and died for that reason. The second person on record to have died.
Another one to consider is Dingo Dinkleman. He already knew he was highly allergic to the venom. With a response of anaphylaxis. Even having a crash cart for himself at the hospital and an emergency kit at home specifically for bites was not enough.
This is something you can find out the hard way. And sometimes even if one bite isn’t too bad, your body can still develop an allergy that will respond if it happens again.
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As an experienced hots guy I agree with everyone before me.
That said, if you choose to proceed, milking is super stressful for the keeper and the kept. It definitely will shorten the animals life. To what degree is unknown. Again, stress. While supplying venom goes to save lives, the snake needs that expensive saliva to digest its food.
As far as laid back or calm it’s a matter of trust between you and them. I’ve had rhino vipers that would tongue flick and advance like any snake that knows you as a source of food. No huff, no puff. Just “food?”
A lot of room is needed as well. You cannot keep them in a cluttered snake room like harmless snakes. If you happen to momentarily lose control you need to be able to recapture safely. Not start moving stuff around to find it. That room needs to lock like Fort knox and be clearly labeled as to its contents. With a treatment plan in place. First responders do not like surprises. Don’t forget everybody else in the house.
You will need tools. Trap and shift boxes. Feeding and handling tongs. Lockable, escape proof cages. And DO NOT CHEAP ON TOOLS or any equipment.
Sorry for yelling.
A vet that will help you. You really need to luck out here.
Antivenom. Here’s the big cost. Again, don’t cheap out, it will save you. Good luck getting it. Took me over two years to acquire bitis polyvalent and I had to have a dedicated crash cart at my nearby hospital. I couldn’t get naja. Get freeze dried(lyophilized). The price of a decent used car for the lot.Controlled by your physician. I interviewed several doctors before I found a doctor suitable. He was trained at SAIMR. Lucky me.
Very important, a mentor. Someone else to tell you to smarten up if your being risky. Someone to teach you all the stuff not to do. To show you proper, safe procedure. And to be there when s#$% hits the fan and you need help to live.
If I am being too blunt- too bad.
My mentor died from a bite and he was very experienced.
I have kept rhino vipers, copperhead, eastern diamond back, and cobra and others. Where I live there are rattlers. I have done a few backyard removals. So not limited to captive, relaxed specimens.
All that said, if you choose to go ahead, ask questions. Even dumb, obvious ones, if your not 100% sure of something, ask. Again, a mentor. If you have the chance to work in someone else’s facility, do it.
Just because we all kinda ragged on you doesn’t mean we wouldn’t help you. Or berate you unnecessarily. You are one of us. Let’s keep it that way.
Good luck and please, put a manure ton of thought and planning in before the snake comes home.
If you proceed also know that pics are mandatory.
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Oh boy, where do I begin with this?
I have a good friend who keeps a lot of higher end hots (Sharpnose, Mambas, Gaboons & Rhinos, true Cobras, Taipans… just to name a few) and is well known with them. I’ll tell you some things I’ve been told by him.
Its not a matter of “if”, its a matter of “when”. He has thankfully never been bit but he knows people who have and he himself has had a few very close calls that could’ve put him 6 feet in the ground pretty quickly.
He has owned a hot that killed one of its previous owners… he ended up having to move it on to someone else because it was so aggressive that even he was fearful of working with it. He’s had many years of experience with hots and that was a first for him…
If you want to get into hots… there are NO begginer species, they will always be “expert difficulty”. You’ll need hundreds if not thousands of hours working under a mentor AND experience with non-hots to the point that you know every little thing about them before you ever are truly ready to own a hot. To quote my friend “if you can’t avoid getting bit by a non-venomous you absolutely are not going to avoid getting bit by a venomous”.
Think about their care and well-being as well, you will have to regularly interact with them to keep them clean, change their water, and feed them. Every single time you do you are flipping a coin on whether or not you f**k up and get bit. Also think about if they need a vet, where are you going to find a vet with experience working with hots and is willing to work with them? They are VERY few and far between.
On the topic of care, feeding for hots can be very difficult. Some hots are solely eaters of specific animals like lizards, amphibians, birds, or other snakes. Where would you get them that food? That isn’t WC and full of parasites or diseases…
Familiarize yourself with what it looks like to get bit by a hot. If you see those images think to yourself, are you really willing to end up like that just because you want to have a hot? Are you willing to lose limbs or very much likely your life? Is it really worth it?
I wont even start with breeding them. That is a whole extra level of risk and work.
That just covers the surface of owning hots. There is so much that you need to know about hots that can’t be covered in a reply so I hope and pray you heed what you have been told.
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I just don’t understand the desire to keep hots. There are SOOOOOO many other species that are way more pretty and well tempered and they can’t kill you. I guess it’s an adrenaline thing, like sky diving, base jumping and rock climbing. At least with those you’re more in control than with hots.
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Yup! I agree! This is another great point!
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Everyone has hit all the important cautionary points.
The only real “beginner” venomous snakes would be rear-fanged species that lack medically significant venom. If you like the look of cobras, look into false water cobras. You’ll get a beautiful, impressive, intelligent snake, complete with a hooded defensive display, whose bite will not kill you (barring some sort of allergic reaction, which is always a risk with any venom).
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Okay, thanks for the advice! I’ll definitely get someone to teach me, and I’ll look into the false water cobras.
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I don’t know anything about hot snakes but i did watch some excellent videos about false water cobra and the biggest down side is they poop alot and need cleaning four times a week . So going on holiday might not be so easy .
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If you ever want something thats a little more spicy than a FWC I’d reccomend Mangrove Tree snakes.
NOT to be mistaken with Mangrove Pit Vipers. They are completely different species!
They are rear fanged and their venom is a bit more significant than a FWC or a Hognose but they are still not considered dangerous to people. Unless you are allergic as stated many times. They look beautiful imo and they are arboreal. They really give off that venomous snake vibe without the risk of killing you.
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Get a hognose. Stay away from hots if you have no experience with them.
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I keep rattlesnakes and heloderma but I work a lot of different species at another facility. The first thing you need to understand is that a venomous bite has a price tag of $250,000 minimum. I’ve seem that cost range from $250k to $1.4 million. In most cases your health insurance is not going to cover the bill. People have ended up bankrupt and homeless over venomous bites. Anti-Venom for anything other than rattlesnake bites is not kept on hand at any hospital.
Typically they have get on the phone to zoos or venom labs and have to ask them if they’re willing to donate any anti venom (assuming they even have the type you need) the cost of the life flight to pick up said anti venom will be added to your hospital bill. In the case of the recent taipan bite, there were only a few facilities in the entire country that had any at all and one of those facilities outright declined to provide it. They are not legally obligated to do so. Venom 1 in Florida had just enough to save his life.
Most of the time a bite is a life changing experience. You’re very likely to lose fingers or even hands. Your kidneys may never function on their own again. The worst case scenario is your family won’t even get to say goodbye because you won’t be conscious.
I would forgo the dream of selling anything to a venom lab. You’d need a literal million dollar facility in order for any of the pharmaceutical companies to consider buying from you. Most of the private keepers that claim they sell venom to labs are lying just like the rattlesnakes round ups lie about doing it. At the end of the Sweetwater roundup they just throw it away.
There are no ‘chill’ cobras and high speed elapids like cobras, mambas, taipan, etc are not something you want to approach keeping until you’re well trained and confident in your skill not. One of the hardest things to learn about keeping venomous is to remove yourself from your ego and truly understand the limits of your skill and abilities. Thinking you know what you’re doing is exactly why venomous snakes will inevitably be banned in South Carolina after the whole Jeff Leibowitz thing. That brings up the point that what you keep is going to rely heavily on what state you live in.
If you’re going to keep venomous, you need a mentor. There is so much nuance that you need to understand or things will end badly. You need to know when you’re in control of the hook or when the snake is actually in control of the hook. It can be a very subtle but very important difference. You need to know how to remain calm when things go sideways. When a C. Atrox melts off the hook and shoots under a rack you don’t want to be in uncharted waters. When you lose discipline and turn to look at something that moved and a spitting cobra nails you in the eye, you need to know how to hold it together while your secure the snake, get your eye flushed while also grabbing your bite protocol, calling 911, and making your way to a place the ambulance can find you. There are a THOUSAND other things you never consider unless you’re trained to consider them. And then you need to be experienced enough to be calm enough to still execute your protocols when things get wavy.
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Why aren’t venomous snakes banned/illegal period, with the exception of being kept in legitimate venom labs?
After reading your post I think anyone wanting to own a venomous snake just for kicks has a death wish!
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The fact that less than a dozen people die from venomous bites in a given year and enforcement is essentially impossible are probably the main reasons.
If someone is trained correctly, they need never have a close call.
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IF is the biggest little word in the dictionary…
IF is the operative word here….
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