Hey guys, so I bred a snow male corn snake with unknown other genetics to an amel female with no other known genes this year and got 3 babies in total (I know that’s not that great, fertility was off). Out of the three of the babies, one that I still have has a nice high white background and looks a lot prettier than the other two babies I hatched. I’m wondering if she could possibly be a candy cane, or if that’s even possible. What exactly is the Candycane morph, and how is it achieved? Thank you in advance for any help. I can add pictures of the baby when I get the chance if anyone wants to see her.
I’d love to see her. Candy canes are so seasonal!
She’s not the best example of a candy cane but I think I can line breed her to make nice candy canes along the lines.
She’s cute! I would not classify her as a candy cane, though. Candy canes are a line bred morph (genetically just amels, but over time have been bred to have that white and red look). A lot of times they are from Miami lines and a lot of times they are het cinder (because that often adds white/reduces yellow in amel based morphs). Those little splotches of orange she has in between her saddles will increase and intensify in color as she ages, so she will look less like a candy cane with every shed.
I know she doesn’t look like much of a candy cane but I thought that maybe if I bred her to the whitest amel babys I produced next year, and maybe mixed in some Miami lines and/or cinder over time that I could achieve a candy cane? What do you think?
Yes, starting a line breeding project like that could definitely work. You’d obviously want to pick a male for her that displays more of the trait that you want to see and then hold back the best babies, etc.
Personally, I think you’d be better off selecting an actual candy cane pair and going from there, but if you have an emotional attachment and really want to use her, I understand that! Just know that it will probably be several generations of babies before you start seeing the results you want (each generation being about 3 years, so could be like 9 to 12 years).
This honestly gives me an excuse to keep her as she is one of the only 3 babies in my first year of breeding that made it. She is also 100% het anery if that’s makes any difference.
I totally understand! I still have one of my babies from my first clutch and he’s not even a good example of his morph, haha! But I still love him.
Het anery won’t make a difference for a candy cane project, but if you wanted to go a different direction and make some snows, that would be perfect for that!
I have a visual pair of ready to breed snows so I don’t need her for that, but that’s ok.
Hi again, so I was trying to figure out how to put together cinder and Miami together with amel to make a candy cane and I am wondering how you put those together with it still just being an amel . I realized that a cinder, amelanistic corn snake is considered a peppermint, well what is the difference visually between a peppermint and a candycane?
Miami is a line bred type. So when you have an amel Miami, that is what a candy cane is. The only reason I mentioned cinder is because it can sort of be a “shortcut” to a Miami look. Het cinder often creates a grayish background color (or more whiteish in an amel morph). Peppermint is homozygous cinder and amel. They typically have far less red than a candy cane and definitely no yellow (candy canes have been line bred to try to reduce yellow, but it can still be somewhat present, especially along the neck and chin). Peppermints also usually have paler eyes, usually light pink or even close to white. The red in a Peppermint is usually sort of interspersed with white - they don’t look like clean, stark red on white like a candy cane.
In case you haven’t already looked through these pictures, here are some Peppermints: Amel Cinder Cornsnake - Ians Vivarium
And here are candy canes: Candycane Cornsnake - Ians Vivarium
I know that’s a lot to take in, so please let me know if I need to clarify anything else!
Thank you so much, I think I may be starting to understand this . I love the candycane gene, but man are those peppermints stunning . So the next step for me (other than waiting till my female is up to size of course) and the fastest way to getting the desired result with my female would be to buy a male visual candycane and breed them together right? Then breed the babies together to get better ones? How many generations can you breed siblings together before it causes defects though?
Yes, that would be the plan. Alternatively, if you like the look of peppermints better, you could always go with a male cinder (or ideally a cinder het amel) to produce babies that were het cinder and amel, and then in the next generation you could produce visual peppermints.
As far as inbreeding, I’m not sure if there’s a set limit to when you’ll start seeing defects, but outcrossing is definitely a good idea.
You could likely go a couple generations without terrible deformities but I personally would recommend avoiding breeding siblings together when there’s another option.