My snake is about 8 months old (I got 3 months ago). About 6 weeks ago, I noticed that I could hear a very faint popping noise coming from his head when I was holding him - and also occasionally a fast outgassing noise (I wonder if this is what people call ‘sneezing’ in snakes but not sure). Then, later that week I noticed him hanging out with his mouth slightly open. So… I took him to the vet. She put him on a 3 week course of antibiotics (Ceftazidime, intramuscular every 3 days). That finished two weeks ago. I thought for a while that that was helping but the popping and ‘sneezing/outgassing’ hasn’t really gone away. Today I found him again hanging out with his mouth slightly open (see picture).
He has been eating and pooping fine and putting on weight. His temperatures are steady at 84, humidity is 40%.
So, what do you all think is the next step? I’m guessing another vet visit, but given that we just finished giving him antibiotics, I’m wondering if anyone knows what else the vet or I can do for him.
Back to the vet, for sure. He may need a longer course of antibiotics or a different antibiotic entirely. If it’s fungal or viral, another type of treatment may be required.
Welcome to the community, @dresbigmoney. @noodlehaus is right, your little guy needs some additional meds. In the meanwhile, you might bump up his heat a bit. A little extra warmth can be helpful when they’re fighting off a problem. Temps around 86-87 give a tiny metabolic nudge without getting into the danger zone. One other thing, if there’s any substrate in his enclosure, you could remove that and go with paper towels or newsprint. Nearly every sort of substrate can produce some degree of dust/particulate matter, which can be an irritant to the respiratory tract.
He’s a cute snake. Hopefully he’ll get over this challenge soon. RIs can be really stubborn. Good for you for paying attention and getting him the care he needs.
Ok, so thank you both, and I did I read about turning up the temps a bit. The thing I noticed though is that any time it starts approaching 85 on the hot side he tends to go to the cool side and is therefore colder overall… The vet also said to get him an overhead heat source for a couple hours a day (most of his heat is from under the tank), which I did, but again, he runs away from it when its on, even though I keep it pretty cool… ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Sounds like you’re trying all the right things. I had a female corn once who would get a persistent RI, but only when she was in shed. Other times, she was fine. Do you notice any cycling of worse/better symptoms? Or is it the same all the time?
@snakes_of_shadowlake Well, I don’t think there’s much cycling going on - I don’t think the (very faint) popping noise every really went completely away - and he just went through a shed maybe 3 weeks ago. I’m afraid to ask, but did your snake get better, worse or stay the same over time?
Get your vet, when you see them, to check the nostrils for debris. I have a python that makes chirping noises that appear when blue but go away after sloughing. Looking at the skin ,I see a small deformity in the nostril.
Checking for anything in the nostrils is a good thing, as @gabonica1 mentioned. Some of them will breathe with a bit of whistle or pop when they’re in shed. This doesn’t usually cause them to sit around with their mouth open as you describe yours doing, though. That’s definitely an indication that something is wrong, not just normal shed noise.
Sorry for the late reply. I called the vet the day she started gaping and had a very goopy mouth. It took a couple days to get in, and by the time we actually went in, she had already shed and looked better immediately. He said she was healthy and clear enough to breed so we thought we were safe to do so. But, after she was already gravid, the exact same thing happened during her next shed. I was so worried the stress of pregnancy would do her in, but she made it through with flying colors. The best news of all was, is that in her most recent shed, she had zero signs of any respiratory issue.
@snakes_of_shadowlake: I’m happy to hear your snake is good (and apparently a mother).
@caryl: I know a bit about the shedding issue (actually this was suggested by the breeder who sold me the snake as well). But, there really isn’t any correlation between the breathing noises (i.e. very faint popping noises and sometimes what I call ‘outgassing’ noises that sound kind of like… well like the ‘woosh’ sound silent farts make) and the shedding. In fact, he just went through a shed maybe 2 or 3 weeks ago (which went fine) - and was making those noises off and on both before and after.
I had a vet appointment for this Monday cancelled due to the vet getting sick, so I’m going tomorrow instead. I’m not that worried about the snake for that amount of time. The fact is that he has had these symptoms (which are worrisome but not really severe) for over a month now. @gabonica1 & @caron: I don’t really know what you’re referring to as a deformity in the nostril - do you see it on his left or right nostril? But I will definitely ask the vet to check specifically that. The snake doesn’t have any mucous and the inside of his mouth looks fine.
In other news, I actually had a completely separate issue that I’m a bit ashamed of. I might make a new thread about it, but here is the short version: the snake is 56g and ~32 inches. Looking at feeding charts (https://www.reddit.com/r/cornsnakes/comments/16934lq/is_this_feeding_chart_correct/) and the width of his widest section, I decided he could deal with some larger prey, an 8g hopper. He got it down and I thought everything went well. 8 days later (so 6 days ago) I fed him two 4g fuzzies I had. Yesterday, I was cleaning his cage and discovered hiding under the substrate the mummified corpse (barely recognizable) of what I think is the 8g mouse. I actually changed his entire bedding to check whether he had also regurgitated the two 4g mice. But (luckily!) he hadn’t. So, my questions were: is 8g too big for a snake his size? And - what do I do about his next feeding? On one hand, I know I should feed him less because of the regurge, but on the other, he’s also now had one full meal without any issues.
A 54g snake should be able to handle an 8g meal, but sometimes going up in prey size can be iffy, depending on the individual’s metabolism.
Do you have a photo of the regurge? Are you certain it was a regurge, or is it possible he never ate it in the first place? I would have a hard time thinking you could have missed it for that long because they smell SUPER strong. Either that, or you must have some very deep substrate. Also, did you hold him close to the time you fed him? That can definitely prompt a regurge. I usually wait 48 hours to hold them after eating.
If I were in your shoes, I’d wait a full two weeks before feeding again and give him a meal about half the size as what his weight can handle—4g should be good. I know he’s already eaten within a shorter time frame, but that just means he needs more recovery time now. Since he’s passed two mice through a sore system, I might even wait 2.5 weeks.
I know you’re working on balancing temps and humidity for the RI? What are they currently? Those will, of course, affect digestion, in addition to the RI itself.
@snakes_of_shadowlake So, I don’t have a picture of the regurge. Like I said, it was desiccated and barely recognizable (the head looked like a black stump) - I could tell it was a mouse because I saw a pair of bony legs - and there’s nothing else it could be. I actually wondered if perhaps it came out of his cloaca like that - but think then it would look like… poop, right? He definitely ate the mouse: it was his first time having a big meal so I watched the whole production. I don’t know how I didn’t smell it - I do have a bad sense of smell, but still… I was kind of grossed out when I found it, but I also don’t remember it smelling that strongly when I was holding it. And ok, about his feeding, I’ll cut back and also ask the vet. His temps are around 84/85 on the warm side, humidity is around 40%, so I don’t know. He spends maybe 1/2 his time on cool side, maybe a little less.
I concur, you should wait and feed a smaller meal just in case that was a regurge. That said, I also concur with @snakes_of_shadowlake in wondering if what you found was actually a mouse that the snake didn’t eat instead of a regurge. Regurges smell HORRIBLE, and it’s a pervasive kind of stench. As in, you enter the room and immediately know something is wrong. Yes, it’s worse than just an uneaten meal decaying. Much worse.
Well, so this is my first snake - watching him eat is one of the coolest parts of it (maybe it’ll wear off, but not yet) so I’m pretty sure I’ve seen him physically eat every mouse I’ve ever given him… That said, it could have happened an hour afterwards. Also, I noticed two other things around the time of the large feed: I didn’t see him at all for like a week afterwards (he’s usually out at least some of the time) and in retrospect, he didn’t poop much after that feeding. Then again, even if I didn’t smell it, its not like I’m the only one that comes into this room - so if it really was as foul smelling as you say, someone would have noticed - so I really just don’t know what’s going on with that. I mean - they never poop anything even vaguely mouse-shaped right?
They will normally go hide after a regurge, so the behavior is consistent. Since it was a larger meal, however, the snake may have just been hiding to try and digest.
A regurge is really a seriously foul scent. I would expect someone to notice, even if it was down in the bedding. Even if they only pass the door to the room. It is different from digested waste, even stinky waste. It smells strongly like rot and vomit and waste all at once.
Actually, they can pass some pretty poorly digested prey sometimes. Since this was a bigger meal and your snake is having some potential RI issues, what you found may have actually passed through the animal.
About the hiding: yes, I also assumed he was just digesting.
About the partially digested food: that’s very interesting and I didn’t know that at all, I thought all their poops were… poopy. And that might actually also explain the timing: he was still digesting the big meal, slowly, then I gave him another meal (8 days later) that sort of ‘pushed’ the first one out - and it explains why I didn’t see it for like 2 weeks post big feed… So yeah, if they can poop out partially digested mice, then I think that’s what probably makes the most sense. Thank you @caryl !
Gonna chime in here because I’ve had regurges that don’t stink. It kind of depends on a few factors, including how long it was digesting, as well as substrate type/moisture content. I’ve had a snake regurg a solid week after being fed, and enough digestion had happened that the rodent fur essentially became a scent barrier. No smell until you disturbed the top layer and then it was awful. I’ve also had one where the bedding was dry/absorbent enough where the regurg scent was locked in while the rodent mummified before I found it, much as @dresbigmoney described.
I do have aspen bedding now - so its more on the dry side. Still - have you also seen partially digested poops? I mean, given the timing of when I found it, I still think that makes more sense. What I’m thinking I’ll do is 1) ask the vet, and 2) maybe wait 10 days and only feed him a single 4g fuzzy. I think that works OK in either scenario.
