Crested Gecko Trait Overhaul- (In Progress)

The crested gecko category could really use traits that are specifically for base colors, like “red base” and “black base”. The way that sellers label their geckos has having a certain base color right now causes confusion and miss labeling which for example makes looking for a “dark” crested gecko difficult because that trait is flooded with dark based crested geckos because sellers have no better option or just assume that means dark base. I think that adding (or reforming) traits for red base, black base, lavender base, yellow base, and orange base would be beneficial and greatly appreciated by many.

Similarly adding (or reforming) traits for pattern colors could be beneficial as well, like white pattern, orange pattern, yellow pattern, and cream pattern.


I agree heavily!!

We have #mp-crested-color and #mp-crested-pattern on the Morphpedia articles, which is still a work in progress, but the actual trait tags are not self explanatory.

I think we need a complete overhall of the way crested traits are listed…

I think the below should have the suffix “Base” added for clarity:

Black - Dominant
Red - Recessive
Yellow - Dominant

And a few that should be updated into combos:

Lavender = Combo (Black Base + Hypo),
Charcoal = Combo (Black Base + Phanom)
Pink = Combo (Red Base + Hypo),

Tangerine is not a “base color” but rather an inc-dom enhancer that interacts with the pattern color.


Absolutely! There is a lot of room for improvement right now, giving the crested gecko trait index an overhaul would be highly beneficial!

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The crested gecko trait index could really use an overhaul. Our understanding of how crested gecko morphs and traits work has changed significantly, especially within the past year.

For starters, almost everything on the trait index could use clarification or just isn’t labeled as it’s understood today. For example, the label “dark” is confusing, it could be taken as dark base, dark pattern, or something else, this floods that trait with an inconsistent assortment on animals, making it hard to find what you’re looking for.

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Just a few changes that I think could make a huge improvement:

•Renaming “Black” to “Black Base”
•Renaming “Red” to “Red Base”
•Renaming “Yellow” to “Yellow Base”

•Merging Bi-color and Patternless into Phantom, all Bi-colors and Patternless geckos are Phantom, the difference is genetically and visually insignificant

•Creating/Renaming categories for “White Pattern”, “Orange Pattern”, and “Cream Pattern”.

Those are just a few improvements that I can thing of off the top of my head, but I’m sure there’s many more that could be made!

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Crested gecko morphs and traits are difficult, very difficult. The way everything has been categorized so far makes no sense. For a long time people sought after different ways to label their geckos, even when their was no fundamental difference, which makes categorizing them so difficult. I think we really need to cut the fat and start fresh with a more simplistic and genetically significant trait index, but maybe that’s an unpopular opinion to have! I’d love to hear others thoughts on this

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This is the route we are taking :wink:

Yellow Base
Black Base
Red Base

Orange Patterning
White Patterning

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Indeed, however all Phantoms are not Bi or Patternless. I think merging may be the wrong way to go.

Patternless have no pattern, whereas Bi does show difference in the dorsal vs lateral


Dark base is also black base.
Most here say ‘dark base (black)’.

There’s more ‘base colours’ though.
I have tangerines here, there are oranges too, creams, olive is a base colour, grey, brown…
Along with the lavender, red, pink…

There’s a lot :sweat_smile:

They are all part of the ‘phantom’ gene.

But I agree, do not merge.

This will cause confusing more and people will start changing names which we don’t need more of :face_exhaling:


More colour patterning also, orange, cream, brown, black, white etc.

Are you going to be listing all along with base colours?

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Have you checked out LMR’s genetic foundation guide online?
Basically everyone is on there, well most of what we know! :grin:


This here…
I have tangerines myself that I breed. It’s a base colour, I also have orange. They aren’t the same colour wise, there’s a difference.
This was one of the things we spoke about back along. The us and the uk have different views on tangerines…
which was why it was said about adding 2 different types.

I have! It keeps crashing on me though so I haven’t heen able to read all of p2😭

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That’s true! I’ve just noticed that a lot of people label their geckos as both so both traits basically have the same geckos, that’s where the merge thought came in

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There is not :slight_smile:
All other “bases” are made up of a combination of Red, Yellow, Black + other traits.

Tangerine is not a “base color” but rather an inc-dom enhancer that interacts with the pattern color. It can be combined with base colours other that Red to produce non-tangerine coloured animals.

Orange phenotype animals are combos that can be achieved in a few ways. Its not a individual trait.
Red + yellow
Red + Phantom

Is a lack of base color - something else is going on here

All combos of Hypo or Phantom + Red, Yellow, Black

There are only 2 Pattern colours. All others are combo influences.

This is where this info is coming from :wink:

The way the crested community has been naming traits is, to put nicely, a hot mess.
Up until now everything has been based off of what a animal looks like, with no focused on genetics. Everything is just thrown under the “line bred/polygenic” umbrella.

Now, with the work from the Foundation Genetics were fixing this.
The crested community needs to catch up


As an example of the FG work, we now know the below traits are At Least Dominant:

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Thing is too, uk and us are very different with some things, I’ve been trying to change many minds and put all this across but a lot don’t agree and think otherwise. unfortunately we won’t get everyone to agree on everything and I’ve given up trying to get people to change how they think. Too difficult in some situations and they really don’t like seeing proof :sweat_smile: I post things on my insta of my cresties, morphs, genes etc and so on, and that’s that, if they ask how I know I explain etc.

But My tangerines I breed are tangerines. The whole geckos are tangerines and most of them phantoms too that hatch out. I only get tangerines and very few choco coloured from the pair.
Where as us use tangerine over there like leopards and the pattern is tangerine to them. So it is different view on the ‘tangerine’ i’d say. Where as the whole gecko to me and people here is tangerine. That’s just one example there as they have like no pattern but some brindling usually. We’ve spoken about it before anyway.

And yes I know it’s an and b making the colour of base or pattern etc, But it’s not something people will list up let up when selling say. To them it’s a say, dark base with orange patterning, they won’t go into detail about what makes what colour and how…

There’s still many people trying to prove many genetics otherwise than what’s out there known still too, I know a couple who are trying to prove some things (let’s just say they think they own many new genes even though I will say, all out there now and talked about online or Lmr site…)

I’ve also read you need a parent with ‘bullseye’ spots to make more with then. I’ve gotten many out and none on parents at all, so maybe a false claim out there but just an example.

Also Superstripe or empty back being recessive, I used to have a superstripe male and no others in lines that I know of, so unless a 1% chance carried I’m not sure… And I had an empty back female again with no others in line but she was producing them with random males she was put to before coming to me, and unfortunately was a lot the poor girl.
Unless I again had very secret low low low hets like my tangerine pair being het phantom, which I spoke to Lmr about the very little chance of them haha. I Know a few breeders too who’ve made EB with non EB parents and even switching pairs have gotten out.
Unless a lot more cresties about are het for many things no one knows, which is most likely case with a lot. Same with royals I suppose! Some surprises!

I think there’s so much more to work out with cresties. And to get every person to agree too is NOT going to ever be easy. They’re not easy and even I’ve hatched out or have in the past, strange ones I’m trying to work out :sweat_smile:

Also the hypo on black base producing lavenders I’m curious on… as then says on red base produces pinks/neon reds. Which I knew. But I’ve been thinking,
As the Only reason I knew Akira was hypo was because her red tricolour baby I was holding back (mini her) turned lavender, so red based not black, she’s actually made another lavender (Lilly) with a red male too.
And we’ve also gotten a hypo from a red pair, neither to me or anyone else do they appear hypo though, and this hypo isn’t neon red/pink either :thinking:

Still so much to work out :face_exhaling:

Thats what this is for. To get everyone working from the same, correct, information.

If you are not breeding away from a orange combo then all you will see is “tangerines”, but is not a base colour in itself, but rather a combo of the the base + enhancer (Tangerine).

Thats why we are creating combo lists also. So if you list your animal as a Halloween then it will prefill “Black Base + Orange Patterning”, or Charcoal = Black Base + Phantom. Like Batman = Spotnose + Leopard + Clown in ball pythons

Youd need to ask @lmr_lmreptiles about this one.

Sounds like your animals were phenotypically “empty backs” but not necessarily the Empty Back trait.

You can go and buy 5 cresties from the pet store and each one will have at least 2/3 traits because the crested community has overlooked the genetics of the animals for so long and mashed anything and everything together. You have likely got many het animals that you dont even realise.

Case in point :wink:

I agree but that is the job of people breeding these animals, to learn what they are really doing with what information is available.

Its not a one or the other equation. They can be Red Base + Black Base + Hypo. As they fire up/down/age you will see changes in the way the crystals in the scales display.

There is more than one form of hypomelanistic trait in Crested. Hypo and Phantom being just two. There are others being worked with to figure out that may prove recessive, but Hypo (the name of the trait) is Dom.

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OMG how did I miss this discussion :scream:

On a side note. I have a suggestion.

ATM when looking at a crestie, if you click on the one of the Geckos traits it take you to other Geckos with that trait (or supposedly with that trait).

Would it make more sense to have the link take you to the correct page on morphpedia? It will likely help increase knowledge of traits & help if people miss advertise so people don’t buy the wrong gecko.

Would be great if there was a link from morphpedia direct to available geckos within that category also.

Sorry if it’s been mentioned, just wanted to throw the ideas out there as may help esp with issues, like a few mentioned already :arrow_up: