Do the animals themselves *care* about natural-LOOKING enclosures? 🤔

[jawramik]

Oh yeah, I know the bites from large constrictors aren’t really serious in the sense of needing medical attention…but they hit you like a truck and you’re probably going to be bleeding pretty good, so it doesn’t exactly seem like a good time. But I’d much rather take a bite from a large constrictor than, say, a big iguana or monitor (or an emerald).

[banereptiles]

For sure! The worst bite and injury I have personally seen on someone came from a breeding mode male green iguana! Most people would not expect that!

[adra]

Oh, yes—I know most snake teeth are nothing compared to a carnivorous mammal like a dog or cat (or even the incisors on larger rodents/rabbits)! It may sound weird, but actually I’m more afraid of being startled than I am of any pain or injury. I once heard about a constructor bite where the snake held on (I’m guessing a mistaken feeding response), the human panicked and pulled away, and the snake ended up losing a number of teeth… some of which ended up lodged in the bite site, and (harmlessly) being expelled as the wound healed. I just think… how would I NOT instinctively jerk my hand/arm/whatever away? That seems like basic reflex. I don’t want the poor snake to lose teeth or having mouth bleeding/infection because of it… that would be awful.

My juvenile skink bit me on the thickest part of my forearm, the first time I held her on my lap. I almost think it was an experimental thing, like: “Hmm… This taste good? Nah, too chewy…” or “I bite, you put back in box and give more food?” She tentatively nipped at my arm, then, with a little more commitment, widened her mouth over as much arm as she could, and gave it a good chomp. Then she she seemed to shrug it off, and just settled down and relaxed a bit, sitting with me for around ten minutes before going calmly back into her enclosure. She never did anything like that again, so I’m guessing since I didn’t react, she decided that it was not an effective means of getting me to drop her, nor was arm tasty enough to be worth the effort? Neither broke the skin or hurt much, although they bruised a bit.

I can confirm that rabbits and Guinea pigs bite (and CLAW) to much nastier effect, as I had both for pets growing up. A cat bite from a scared stray (we still managed to rescue and adopt her, after her quarantine period was up—RIP, dear Vampira ) sent my dad to the ER, and led to X-rays, antibiotics, and a long recovery with possible nerve damage. I’d much rather tangle with a boa’s teeth than a real cat or dog bite any day—they’re only “gripping” teeth, not “rend flesh from bone” or “kill instantly with 2-inch canines” teeth. Actually… the dentition on the emerald tree boa… kind of reminds me of feline teeth…

@caron

What are SFE’s?

It was a term I used to see around reddits and similar, as an abbreviation for “Stupid Feeding Errors”. People would post about incidents with their own pet snakes, explain why the bite happened, and where they—the owner—messed up to cause it. The idea was to teach other herp keepers safe practices, and what to avoid doing (handling rodents and not washing hands before feedings, startling the snake while it was sleeping, etc.).

@caron

As far as feeding FT, depending upon what snake you get and the breeder, chances are you will be getting a snake that is already eating FT. If that’s the case, and I highly suggest you make sure that is the case, then all you have to do is follow the instructions of the breeder as to how the snake has been fed and what it is eating. Pinky Fuzzy Small Mouse, etc.

In the wild, snakes eat rodents, lizards, frogs, etc Most of the time the prey is live and therefore eaten whole. Captive bred snakes eat whole prey as well. They need the bones for calcium etc. There is no need to feed a half a rat to a snake. At least I would not be down for that! Lol

I’d heard that when juveniles were started with live, they could be extremely difficult to transition to f/t… which kind of spooked me. I’m just not up for live feeding, for several, fairly non-negotiable reasons (though I do understand why there are certain instances and animals that require it, and I don’t think badly of owners trying to do what’s best/necessary for their pets). If an animal were simply unable to take dead prey (not counting bugs/worms) of some kind, I would have to find them a better home with a more experienced keeper. Up to that point, there’s very little I wouldn’t do to ensure the best possible life for my animals. A snake that had previously been eating f/t wouldn’t just arbitrarily begin refusing anything but live, would it? Outside of extremely strange circumstances? I know tarantula slings will take dead prey as they’re still growing (safer for itsy-bitsy spiders, lol), but may refuse pre-killed insects once mature.

@caron

So @adra, if I know you, and I think I do, lol, it may take you several months to figure out what kind of snake you want lol! So once we get over that hurdle, then we will make sure you will be able to feed that snake like a pro and we will help you with everything else as well!

So don’t worry about a thing dear! We gotcha!

Aaawww, thank you so much! That means a lot. There’s really no one in my (non-online) life who likes reptiles—especially snakes—so it’s amazing to just be able to talk to and consult other hobbyists and enthusiasts… At most, my closest family/friends are tolerant of my interests, but tend to cringe at any mention of snakes, and in some cases spiders, or even lizards. It’s so sad to me how mainstream cultural influence, misinformation, and perhaps an inherent and/or instinctual fear—even despite knowing better*—can result in so many people fearing or hating these beautiful animals.

(*For clarity, there are no seriously dangerous snakes, only one (uncommon) dangerous spider, and just a single species of lizard (which, of course, is tiny and harmless) native to where I live. The only reptile here capable of doing a human any real damage (massasauga rattlesnake, which is notably less dangerous than its “cousin” rattlers due to small fangs and low amounts of venom injection) is reclusive, shy, and so rare as to be an endangered/protected species.)

[adra]

@banereptiles

SFE= stupid feeding error.
Weird thing is with babies I kind of like them accidentally striking or biting at me, I relax thinking this one is going to be a great eater!
@jawramik
Just wanted to add even big constrictors a bite is usually not a big deal. The worst thing about them is you get bruised around it from the force. Rarely does anyone need medical attention. I will agree with you 1000% on the emeralds though, my god the teath on those guys! The only other painful type of bite is the chewing that a rear fang snake can do, not worried venom wise but the chewing looks painful!

That’s a great, positive outlook on the baby bites, lol!

I sometimes stare at photos of emeralds’ mouths, and just think… how? How did you, alone, become a living Halloween decoration? I can appreciate the beauty of them—including those impressive chompers!—but I sure wouldn’t want to handle or feed one, knowing that that bear trap was waiting inside.

I always heard that if you let a rear-fanged chew on you, the increased amounts of venom could lead to worse reactions? Nothing lethal, but I thought a hognose could at least make you feel like you have the flu, if you let it go on too long?

@jawramik

Oh yeah, I know the bites from large constrictors aren’t really serious in the sense of needing medical attention…but they hit you like a truck and you’re probably going to be bleeding pretty good, so it doesn’t exactly seem like a good time. But I’d much rather take a bite from a large constrictor than, say, a big iguana or monitor (or an emerald).

@banereptiles

For sure! The worst bite and injury I have personally seen on someone came from a breeding mode male green iguana! Most people would not expect that!

Oof, yes… the greens are kind of spooky. Even though most iggies are vegetarians, lol. I want a rhino iggy at some point, and the Cyclura species are known to be a lot friendlier… but do the males still get moody seasonally, when they would normally be going in search of a mate? Is there a substantial difference between keeping a male vs. a female?

[bradburyesqu]

@jawramik

*Emerald tree boas are one exception. They have some seriously gnarly teeth, I wouldn’t want to take a bite from one at any size. But most constrictors don’t have teeth like that.

I almost brought that up as an exception. They are also one of my favorite snakes. I just need to get the wife over her fear before I can keep them. Those teeth are impressive

[inspirationexotics]

I always tell people I was terrified of getting bitten up until I did, and then it went away. I managed 10 years keeping my first ball python with no bites (feeding or defensive) but then when I started breeding I got nabbed by young male I got in. Startled me more than anything but the pain was so minor it completely got rid of my fear. Now if I have bitey babies I’ll just hold my hand in front of them and let them go at it. Baby balls, at least. I’ve also been tagged by my african house snakes, who have remarkably large teeth for their size, but still minor. I still get startled from the sudden movement but pain wise, I’d rather go down the line and let every single one of my snakes bite me than ever get bitten or scratched by a dog or cat again.

[bradburyesqu]

You know reading through this I had to laugh. Reptile people, me included, are probably the only pet owners with the “meh” attitude about our animals biting. We might be as weird as the fluffy animal people think we are.

[monty_pituophis]

I remember getting bit for the first time. I no longer feed hungry 6’ colubrids with 9" tweezers. I got a pair of the 24" now. They’re all rusty because I also use them in my SW aquarium, but at least I’m not getting bit.

[flrt-dennis]

I will add most snake bites (non venomous) are usually no big deal but please dont underestimate the damage a large constrictor can do people. I have a friend with permanent nerve damage from a 55 pound suriname bite, another that needed stiches from an adult emerald tree boa. I get what everyone is saying but large constrictors should always command respect and common sense when feeding/handling.

[bennyandjammy]

Definitely agree on don’t underestimate large constrictors i mean look at the burm skull i put here the amount of teeth and size of the teeth will definitely make you think twice about keeping the snake

[caron]

Awwwwww Thank you so much for clarifying that Nathan! I will file that away for future reference!

[adra]

What would or wouldn’t qualify as a large constrictor, in this case? Because I feel like there are people out there right now, who would see a year-old bp in a pet store, and go “WHOA, AN ANACONDA!!! It could eat you!!! ”

In all seriousness, though… what size and/or species (all emeralds being a given, lol) would be at the point where stitches could be in your future, if you get sloppy? I’d be more afraid of constriction-related accidents with a Burm or larger (or really, anything I’m not confident I could overpower in an emergency), but getting tagged by a big retic in a huffy mood doesn’t seem like much fun either. If only there were 30-foot egg eating snakes, who fed on ostrich eggs or something… that would be amazing for me, lol.

[jawramik]

You’re absolutely correct, of course. Large constrictors are big, powerful animals that need to be respected. I think sometimes people like us (myself 100% included) are in such a hurry to dispel the myth that snakes are vicious, dangerous, blood-thirsty creatures that should be feared that I think I sometimes gloss over some of the genuine dangers that really do exist. I’m trying to work on that, but it’s a work in progress.

[jawramik]

I feel like that’s a little subjective. The most common figure I’ve seen quoted is that anything 10+ feet counts as “really big” and requires extra precautions.

But I feel like it also depends on the size, strength, and experience level of the keeper in question. For a person on the smaller side, 7-8 feet would probably be quite a lot of snake. An 8-foot boa is still going to be an incredibly strong and powerful animal.

On the flip side, there are some slender arboreal snakes that can potentially approach the 8-10 ft mark, but they’re not going to have the same strength and power of a heavier-bodied snake, so I would argue that something like a big coastal carpet python doesn’t pose anywhere near the same potential risk as a boa constrictor of similar length.

I’ve waffled back and forth a bit on where I draw the line of “too big for me.” It’s hard, because I love big snakes and would love to have something like a burm or mainland retic someday, but I think more realistically, 7-8 feet is about where I’d draw the line. And I’d only feel okay about taking on a snake that would get that big if I could start with it as a baby, so we could figure each other out when it’s small (and mistakes will cost me less), and we can both sort of “grow into” their adult size together.

[caron]

@adra

I’d heard that when juveniles were started with live, they could be extremely difficult to transition to f/t

As long as you go about it the right way, it is usually not that difficult to switch a baby/juvenile from live to FT. I have done it many times over the years, a lot of times on the first try. I’m not bragging because it took a lot of trial and error. Granted there are some stubborn ones here and there but there are a lot of people here who will be more than happy to assist you with those. Again, you will be better off finding a noodle that is already eating frozen thawed.

@adra

A snake that had previously been eating f/t wouldn’t just arbitrarily begin refusing anything but live, would it? Outside of extremely strange circumstances?

A snake will refuse a live prey just the same as it will refuse a FT. What people get confused about is that there IS a reason. A snake just doesn’t wake one morning and decide it doesn’t want to eat FT anymore or for that matter live anymore. When a snake that has been happily eating consistently and then all of a sudden starts to refuse its food, something has changed. It could be illness, husbandry, environment, breeding age, possibly even a different source of feeders. But there is a reason.

[banereptiles]

You have great points! Also a huge factor is the temperament of your animal. I have a big female retic 14+ and she is such a puppy, sweet girl easily handled by myself and my sd retic is around 7-8’ and I’ve held him since a hatchling never bitten, always been more flighty and nervous though, and this year decided he didn’t want me to hold him anymore. Probably due to being a mature male around a mature female (I didn’t try pairing) and seeing me as a potential “rival?” So he has nailed me 3 times in the past few months(the only time he’s ever tried to bite) so temperament definitely matters, and just because you handle a snake or any reptile from a baby doesn’t always prevent aggression. I am hoping he will get back to his normal nice self soon! Also no lasting damage from any of his bites, a little blood and bruising! I’ve had much worse from working construction or in a pizza kitchen, but those are other stories!

[flrt-dennis]

I totally agree with you, it seems to be a regular occurrence to dispell the fear campaign on snakes in general especially those we keep as pets we love. I just remember taking a hit from a 14’ burm when i was younger and careless while feeding and it was an eye opener, that snake had so much power and i was a very strong young man, avid weight lifter. As we become more knowledgeable about the animals we keep I feel its important that keeping larger breed constrictors we need to remember they posess the power to cause damage if accidents occur.

[flrt-dennis]

Stiches are rarely the case, that guy was hit with large fangs and as a natural reaction he pulled back. Its subjective but I consider large with anything over 8’ and 30 pounds personally. Im not trying to promote fear rather than just be responsible without being over zealous. Here’s a picture of an adult male emerald tree boa I was assisting a friend with medicating the unhappy guy.

[banereptiles]

I thought that was a pit viper with fangs extending! I am just joking, but that mouthful of teeth is definitely no joke!

[flrt-dennis]

Luckily I was on tube duty🤣 Those fangs look bigger in person. For some reason I had high blood pressure that afternoon🤔