Why even breed something that you know can suffer? Just for extra money? For looks? That’s a shame when people prioritize money and looks over the animal’s well being. Reminds me of when ***** or whatever his name was got all butthurt because they banned spiders where he lived. I totally support the ban because breeding spiders knowing that they can suffer through their entire lives is animal abuse
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Why do you think they suffer? Do you think they’re in constant pain just because they have wobble, what real proof do you have that they all suffer or are in pain. Undoubtedly in stressful conditions the wobble can be severe but in a proper stress-free environment there is very little if any wobble. Many of the experienced and ethical breeders here that have experience with spiders can truthfully say that the spiders show minimal if any wobble or pain if they are in a stress-free environment. If you read through the topic then you’d see that many experienced and ethical breeders actually know that spiders are not just horrible and cruel genes that cause pain. If given proper care they can be as healthy as a ball python that doesn’t have wobble genes.
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You have proof of this claim? Or is that just your biased approach to this morph?
No scientific proof has shown they have pain with wobble. Learn to research before you attack the morph that started it all for ball pythons. And have some respect for ***, Brian cares more about his animals than the average person. Maybe if you ever talked to him on a personal level you’d understand that. You have a lot to learn.
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I have seen spiders at petco that can hardly move from wobble. Third, they’re banned in some areas for a reason.
There’s good reasons for the controversy of spiders
What are the scientifically proven and factual reasons then.
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It’s been widely known for a long time that spiders and spider combos can have issues. That’s all the evidence i need to prove that it’s wrong to breed spiders. Honestly they should be banned in the U.S along with other neuro morphs because it’s morally wrong
The thing is most of them don’t have issues if properly taken care of. What are your reliable sources for this information that most spiders have major wobble and can’t live properly and don’t have a good quality of life.
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You’re right, MOST don’t, but it’s those unfortunate few that are born with bad wobble that effects their lives negatively until they die. I never said once every spider or most spiders have issues, they just have a higher rate of being born suffering than other non neuro morphs
So seeing multiple bad spider wobbles in person through a tank beside me is clickbait, ok then lol
Petco has thin sickly reptiles no matter the morph. Check out the places that breed for pet stores if you want to see cruelty.
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Sadly this is the truth and it doesn’t help that there a lot of sensationalist petubers putting out misleading or biased information. Spiders are beautiful. I stayed away from them for month’s while I looked for credible sources to use to make an educated decision about supporting the gene…i think I have about 5 snakes with spider. They all eat great and are very healthy.
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Spider ball pythons do not show wobble if they aren’t in a stressful situation. Most pet stores are a prime example of a stressful situation. All the time people take videos of “how horrible the spider gene is” and they intentionally stress out the snake for the video. Many breeders here have spider genes and they live healthy and normally just as good as a non-wobble gene ball python. If spiders are ethically bred, kept, and sold I don’t see why there should be a problem with them.
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Seriously Petco?! You’re going to reference that and you expect us to take you seriously, ok.
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I mean in a new post they made they said they are new to BP genetics so it is unlikely they have seen a healthy/well taken care of wobble morph in person. So they likely are a kid, or just someone that thinks Petco/Petsmart knows how to care for any of their animals. If they knew anything, they would never have mentioned petco given the horrible care they give to BPs. Let’s just hope they don’t shop/buy animals there . Just another ignorant soul that doesn’t want to listen to people that actually know what they are talking about.
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Guys, this isn’t Facebook, so dont treat it like such.
As controversial as the subject is, disagreeing with statements is fine, attacking the person making the statement is not.
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Nicely done abusing animal genetics, making these poor animals suffer with wobble just because they sell for more and are pretty. People like this shouldn’t even be in the breeding community. 100% animal abuse and monopolizing gene pools
@ghastpixel Spider and Spider combos actually usually sell for less.
And there is no scientific data that suggests they suffer from having a wobble.
And actually people like that should be in the breeding community, no question. It’s called science and research, maybe instead of hating on these individuals who put themselves out there for the benefit of the community, you should try and learn more yourself about the actual facts of this morph.
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The spider morph isn’t as bad as some might want you to believe.
Given the proper care and husbandry, most individuals with spider will exhibit little to no wobble. The ones in my collection rarely show wobble if any, and from what I can see it’s mostly my more stress-prone individuals that tend to show their wobble more. Especially with feeding or handling.
Either way, I respect if you don’t want to support the morph. But please be respectful to the ones that do and don’t jump to ad hominem attacks if you don’t have anything constructive to say.
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“It’s not suffering” when some snakes have such sever wobble that they can hardly even move without falling over?