Insulating a glass enclosure heated w/ tape?

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EDITING TO ADD: I got overwhelmed and scared about the heat tape and it was not working effectively anyways, so ended up just buying a new Fluker’s lamp, a decent lamp stand, and 100w CHE bulbs! I am setting them up with the new Inkbird thermostat that I had bought for the tape!

Hello! I’m sorry if I’m not doing this correctly, I’ve never used MorphMarket before besides browsing. Recently, I had a scare with my only snake, Marigold. I was sitting in my room and her heat lamp shorted out and burst into flame, but since I was right there I was able to get to it before anything besides the lamp was damaged. However this obviously spooked the heck out of me, so I’m ditching lamps, not risking a storebought heat mat, and switching to heat tape. I already got the Inkbird thermostat, and the heat tape arrives tomorrow from Cornell’s World.

I would swap to a PVC enclosure if I could, but I plan to do that when she’s larger, because she’s still not very big right now. So, instead, I am wondering if anyone has any good ideas for insulating a 36" x 18"x 12" Reptizoo terrarium? It’ll be alright until at least late fall, but I live in Saskatchewan where it can hit -40 in the winter, and my room is pretty small and can get quite cold. Not below 10C, but still cold enough that the glass tank can get pretty cold. That’s why I was using the heat lamp, but that’s not really an option anymore.

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Do you have access to sterilite tubs or similar? Plastic tubs hold heat and humidity way better than tanks. I’m talking plastic, not acrylic. You can put your heat tape under the tub with the thermostat. You should not have to worry about insulation.

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Here is a method I have used in the past. Before I go further, it is extremely important that you understand two things here: 1) Do not take shortcuts or use different materials thinking they are “close enough” because that will increase the risk of creating the same issue you are trying to avoid 2) You need to pay close attention for a while after set up because the properties of heat and glass are very dynamic. This is also not a ‘set it and forget it’ technique. You will need to check it frequently (like every hour) after you first set it up so you can get it dialed in properly and I advocate at least weekly checks thereafter

Aside from your thermostat you will need three things. The first is a set of wire cutters. The other two things are

Light diffuser grid:

https://www.lowes.com/pd/PLASKOLITE-Common-24-in-x-48-in-Actual-23-75-in-x-47-75-in-7-85-sq-ft-Louvered-Ceiling-Light-Panels/3280904

Foam insulation board - I like 1” for this. You can go down to 0.5” if you want but I would not go thinner:

https://www.lowes.com/pd/GreenGuard-1-X-2-X-2-Project-Panel-LG-1/5001929511

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Again, DO NOT get something else thinking it is “close enough”. Styrofoam is not dense enough for our purposes and also not rated to take the heat you are working with. It will melt
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Using the wire cutters, trim three sections of the light diffuser to fit the footprint of your cage. Make a sandwich with them in the following order, bottom to top: diffuser, heat tape, diffuser, diffuser. Obviously, your heat tape will not be running the full length/width of your cage footprint, so position it within the sandwich where you want it under the cage. On the top layer of diffuser, directly over the centre of the heat tape, use the wire cutters to trim out a piece or two of the light diffuser to allow the thermostat probe to be set in and not roll around. You can thread the probe wire between the top two diffuser grid pieces or just run it over the top. I then like to use zip ties to secure the probe wire in place and also hold the whole thing together. Now, using a large, sharp knife, cut a piece of foam board to the same footprint as your light diffuser sandwich

Final assembly is simple (again, bottom to top): Foam board, sandwich, cage

Turn on your thermostat, set it to the temp you are targeting, and let the system equilibrate first and then adjust very slowly to get the cage spot where you want it (the few times I was running one of these setups I never had to raise the temp that much from my target, maybe only two degrees, max)

The foam board acts as both an insulator and protection for whatever you have the cage sitting on. The diffuser grid sandwich keeps heat tape from making direct contact with the foam board and the glass, preventing melt through/thermal shatter. The airgap the sandwich provides also helps to buffer against major hot posts from forming

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I don’t have one, but I could probably find one big enough for her to be comfortable in. I wouldn’t want to use that in the summer because this year it’s been between 27C-33C in my room since about late May and super humid, so I worry I would have the opposite problem and have trouble keeping a cool side. But I could pretty easily keep a big tub around to use as her winter tank and use it for storage in the warmer months if I’m not able to insulate her current tank effectively!

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Oh, I meant exterior insulation for around the tank to trap heat inside :smiling_face_with_tear: I already put the heat tape on the bottom as soon as it arrived this morning, I’m sorry, I should have checked here before I set it up. I got woken up by the UPS man and got excited to get her set up, and her breeder was guiding me through it.

When I researched the heat tape, everything I read said that it wouldn’t work properly if it wasn’t flush against the glass, and her breeder said the same thing, so I tried really hard to follow everything they said and what I had read up about it. The only time anyone said anything about thermal shattering was if I didn’t have the thermostat probe in the right place and it got too hot, so I was really careful to make sure it was taped in the right place. I have it on top of an industrial cargo shelf, so it stands up to pretty much anything a grouchy mechanic’ll put on it. The entire bottom gets pretty decent airflow, the tank is lifted on 1-inch feet, and the thermostat probe is taped directly to the center strip of the little black heating elements with HVAC tape. I was really careful not to cover up too much of it, but I made sure it was secure. The thermostat is set to 32C right now, and I’m checking it frequently with a temperature gun. It’s currently 25C in my room. The ground above the heat tape is currently around 27C and rising a little bit at a time.

Is it safe to remove the heat tape and put the insulation in place in a couple of weeks when I am able to buy this stuff? How can I make sure it’s going to give her a proper heat gradient and not just heat up the entire tank so she can never get a cool spot? Would it be better to just put her in a tub? I always said I wouldn’t put her in a tub because her tank is the nicest thing in my room, but now I’m really afraid it’s going to shatter or something, and I can’t even really afford the insulation right now, so I definitely can’t afford to get her a whole new enclosure if that happens. I was hoping I wouldn’t have to buy any insulation until early October because I was just thinking about trapping heat in the tank when it starts to get cold, but if the tank is gonna shatter, then I have to do something.

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Hey @floralabsinthe I wasn’t thinking about @t_h_wyman popping in but since he did I would try to work with him on this because he is waaaaaayyyyy more knowledgeable than me.

I am in the Midwest in the States so I don’t have nearly the hot and cold issues that you do. I’m a tub keeper anyway so that’s why I mentioned trying a tub. However since I’m a tub keeper I always use the UTH mats, depending upon what size tubs the snake is in. I have to mention though that you are the first person since I have been here (2020) who has had an overhead heat lamp/light short and burst into flames! That’s scary! I know a lot of people are afraid of UTH’s but I don’t recall anyone have one of theirs burst into flames! I’m just glad your snake is ok! :sweat_smile:

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How absolutely horrifying! Glad you were actually there when it happened, at least. You prevented catastrophe.

I work with corns rather than BPs but I have several glass tanks with belly heat (various mats and tape) sitting on a thermostat and 1" foam board insulation very much as as described so thoroughly and helpfully by @t_h_wyman. It works just fine.

The excellent air flow you mention under your tank will very much work against the heating efforts. Insulation beneath the tank and heat tape or mat will both hold the heating source in place and mitigate heat loss. If you only have the heat source covering part of the bottom, yes, you’ll have a heat gradient.

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I can tell you from personal experience that heat tape and glass all too often lead to cracked/shattered glass. In fact, I might have a few of my old examples sitting in the shed still
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If your room is running ambient temps like that right now then you can just pull the tape entirely for the time being and your animal will be fine. Those are well within the normal temps a snake will see in the wild so it is not going to be a major stress or hurt your animal to sit at them for a couple weeks if need be. Only thing I would do during that time is to feed smaller meals, preferably on days when you know it is going to be really warm
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Easy enough. Buy some extra (or just a larger) polyfoam board and cut pieces to fit the sides and back. You can use Command strips to get them to stick. If you are more engineer minded, you can cut the dimensions to have overlaps that you can glue together so it is all one piece that you slide onto the unit
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Okay… First things first - Take a deep breath and calm

We are not looking at an imminent life or death crisis. Right now, everything is basically just levels of convenience/inconvenience

You do not have to go to a tub. Tubs and PVC cages make life easier/more convenient but I have said before (and will say again) that you can successfully keep a ball in a glass cage it’s entire life. I know because I have taken a baby and thrown it into a 55G tank and raised it to adulthood without issue. He lived there for over five years. The only reason he is not still in there is because I got really tired of having to haul the glass around with each move. It is heavy and fragile and just got to be too much work for me. And that is the thing I always tell people that want to use glass - It can be done, but it takes WORK (as you are unfortunately discovering right now)

Luckily, many of us have already been through a lot of this so we can walk you through the process. We will get you through
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As you are using metric, I am guessing you are not in the US. Is that correct? I am asking because if I am throwing out solutions that are US-oriented but totally worthless to where you are at, then all we are going to get is frustration. I quote the above as an example. At the Lowes down the street from me, a 240cm x 120cm sheet of 2.5cm thick foam board is only about $30-$35, which seems a very accessible price to my mind. But if you are somewhere that does not have Lowes, or where the cost of that same kind of material is three or four times greater, then these are things I/we need to know to be better able to help. So if you could clarify where you are and maybe what kind of hardware or supply stores you have available then that would be wonderful :+1:

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This is one of the reasons I use tubs. I can’t lift anything heavy, especially a glass tank over 10 lbs and fully decorated complete with substrate.

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I totally understand where you’re coming from! You are proud of her setup, it looks nice, and you want to make it work! TH will help you keep that nice tank!

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I have also seen some gnarly glass cracks or melted plastic

As long as you don’t have it sandwiched between a tabletop and the glass with no airflow they’re usually all right. Even store bought heat mats. I’ve used the little nubs that are sold to keep things from slipping or scratching to raise the enclosure by about 1/4 inch.

It’s a simple thing I’ve had to tell people multiple times about when I worked in a big box shop. :face_with_spiral_eyes:

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Hello again! I am in Canada, yes. But it’s okay! I gave up on the heat tape pretty quickly, it wasn’t even working to get through her substrate before I was able to get any kind of insulation. I had it set to 35 C and I couldn’t get the temps directly above it higher than 28 after letting it ‘acclimate’. And I got a bunch of birthday money, so I just bought a new Fluker’s 8.5" dimmable lamp and a Zoo Med 38" lamp stand and I’m going to set it up with my new thermostat! I had to make a hanging hook thingy for the lamp out of a coat hangar because it only came with a sketchy clamp. I made sure the lamp is rated for 160w and the CHE bulbs I got are 100w, and I’m going to replace it every year now instead of using the same lamp as long as possible.

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I hope this works for you! When you get everything situated we would love to see your Marigold if you would not mind sharing pictures of her! :folded_hands::blush:

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Absolutely! Marigold is hiding right now because I think she’s either about to go into shed or mad about the lack of warmth and the amount of fussing I’ve done this week, but I took one a couple days ago while I was trying to get the heat tape situated! Her tank and bowl has some calcium on it because we have hard water and steel pads can’t scrub it off without scratching up the glass (someone thought they were dirty once so I just wanna clarify they are clean, just calcium-y from misting and stuff like that), and she is a little bit small and slim because I was given improper feeding information (I picked the wrong group for advice and they told me a fuzzy every 2 weeks when she was still very small, it’s egg on my face for not verifying), but she’s recently been put on on a regular schedule for a small rat every 10 days now so I can hopefully help her chunk up a tiny bit.

Also I want to replace her hides with better ones, but I packed the substrate around them and push one side up against the wall and she likes them so much that she protests by sitting only on her driftwood tree whenever I try to give her better ones, because she’s weird.

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Awwwww! Don’t apologize for anything! We won’t yell at you! :blush: The only thing we do sometimes is give constructive criticism when there is a need for the well being of the animal in question!

Marigold is so lovely! What morph? And if she likes her hide I would not change things! She must feel very secure in it! I’m sorry you are so far away up north where it’s even colder but we are all glad you found this forum. The people here are knowledgeable, kind and supportive! Don’t ever hesitate to reach out anytime! You have already interacted with the “Wise One” TH who is straight forward with a wealth of knowledge! But there are also a ton of others here, keepers, breeders, and both! You will get SOLID advice!

Again your girl is lovely! No wonder you want to keep her out in the open! :star_struck::smiling_face_with_three_hearts:

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I’m really really happy that I found this site, honestly. I have a very severe anxiety disorder so I’m always really afraid of getting in trouble for doing something wrong.

My goal is to hopefully one day be able to set up a big bioactive terrarium for her! I use silk and plastic plants for now (no sharp edges!) And I’m pretty certain she’s a Blue-Eyed Leucistic, but I don’t remember ever being told about her parents so I’m not entirely sure what she came from. I am colourblind so I can’t tell her patterns myself, but my roommate says she has a very, very faint wiggly yellow stripe along her spine, and I’ve noticed that she has always had a singular black spot sort of on her neck area. She also has a funny eye with one very large pupil that is kind of wonky-shaped, but it’s never seemed to deter her any.

Yeah, that’s mostly how I’ve been operating! If she seems to like it I don’t mess with it too much, she does plenty of redecorating on her own shoving the fake pothos around haha. I just come along and try to cover the entrance of each half-log with some of the leaves every now and then so she can feel like she’s in a cave. I think part of why she enjoys them is because they’re ceramic, so they stay cool when my room gets really hot.

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No worries here! I’m sorry you are anxious and have an anxiety disorder. It seems this affects a lot of people these days, especially younger people. I’m sure Marigold is a comfort to you physically as well as mentally. Mine are to me as well. :heart:

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Marigold is a beauty with a beautiful name. Her body condition looks fine to me, nice and healthy. Sadly, so many snakes are overfed and much too heavy. It’s not good for them.

I’m sorry you are dealing with anxiety issues. If you don’t want to be yelled at you have found the right place. This is theprobably the most supportive, most constructive community on the 'net.

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I am glad you were able to come to a solution for now that you are comfortable with. When/if you are financially and mentally feeling up to the task of changing over to heat tape, please feel free to loop back around and we can get you where you want/need to be :+1:
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One thing I do want to put out there, I am very frequently terse and to the point, it is just who I am. On more than a few occasions that character trait has been mistaken/misunderstood as brashness/shortness/irritation (as I am sure more than a few people in this thread can attest LOL). I bring this up because of your mention of having anxiety and my not wanting to accidentally trigger it simply by being me. If we should converse here or anywhere else in the forum and you feel I am angry or upset with you, please DM me (or one of the other Mods/Staff if you prefer an intermediary) about it so I/we can get things back on the level. I would very much hate for “normal Travis” to send you into a bad place
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A paper towel with some white vinegar can help you with the glass. Every two months I have to soak every water bowl I have in vinegar as well because of the lime scale I get here. Never ending battle…
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Confirming your girl is a BluEL. All the different “white” variations will develop that faint yellow stripe down their spine, in some it is more prominent than others. Based on simple appearance, your animal is most likely a SuperLesser or Lesser/Mojave-type, but unless you plan to breed there is no need to delve deeper than that

And slight eye abnormalities are not uncommon in the BluELs, which would explain the wonky pupil. Just part of the genetic-level programming getting messed with by the mutation that causes the morph

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