Hey, yesterday I was told I can pick two another pair of snakes to breed along with the boa I’m looking for because we have an opportunity we will never get again as long as i live in this house. But I’m trying to figure out what the pair should be, so I need your help, remember this needs to be something that a first time breeder could get away with breeding(I will do a lot of research and talking other breeders to make sure I can do it), they also need to be around $1000 or less, and most importantly they need to be able to make me money for the next five years of my life. And last please don’t recommend something that is corrupt in the market right now like ball pythons.
Thank you for help.
*edit, everyone read this, I just noticed that I made it sound like I expect profit, and I also said “to keep up with the hobby”, what I meant by both of those was so I can afford to keep doing the hobby! and one other reason I want to is because it seems fun, all the parts of vending seems fun, like trying to get people to buy from me, informing beginners, trading with other venders so that my table is more diverse, and getting to go to expo more often!
This limits you to very basic species, and the research and talking to other breeders/prep needs to be done before the purchase of the animals. You also 100% need to have a significant emergency fund in case of any issues + all of the supplies, equipment, enclosures, a vet, etc. as I told you in your thread last fall about breeding garters.
You’re asking for a unicorn, it doesn’t exist. There is no pair of animals you can buy right now for less than $1000 and start breeding that will make you money, period. Most small breeders barely break even, let alone make any notable amount of money. I’ve been breeding and selling for four years and I’ve yet to actually make any money at all due to some vet expenses incurred my first two years.
My recommendation is don’t get any more animals if this is your reasoning and requirements. If you’re under 18 and living at home yet, what are your plans if you decide to go to college or have to move? Who will care for your animals? You’ve already had a Crestie pass and your replies in that thread suggested that you weren’t keeping the best eye or records on that animal, adding more for the sake of breeding/money is not advised.
As a small breeder, it took me five years of breeding to get to the point where I wasn’t at a complete loss, and now the animals cover my costs of keeping them. They don’t make me any profit. If profit is your reason for wanting to breed, I highly suggest not breeding. You will get burnt out, the animals will suffer. If you really want to breed, find a species that you personally are passionate about, do all of the research you can to know exactly how to care for them, and then keep one for a while before you decide to breed.
sorry, my wording is almost never good the first time, I don’t expect much of a profit, I’m doing this so that I can keep up with the hobby. And hopefully make a small amount of profit, not that that is what I’m looking for though. and these are not the only reptiles I’m breeding these are sord of “backup” to go along with them. but mostly to make more money that the other snakes. And then I’m selling other stuff as well. but it would take to long to explain everything.
*edit, example it took me ten minutes to right that cuz I’m not good at wording text responses and I’m kinda lazy with typing.
If you have 2,000 available to buy a pair of snakes my advice to you is to take that money and put it in an empty coffee container and start adding 100 bucks a week to your stash for a year. By the end of the year you’ll probably end up saving the money you would have spent trying to breed snakes.
Sorry to say this but being realistic here… please don’t breed any animals and expect to make a profit, especially for breeding pairs less than a $1000.
To put this into perspective…
I started considering breeding reptiles for the first time in 2018, my first breeding was of a pair of Kingsnakes in 2020 so that was 2 years worth of thinking, researching and planning. Granted I got both Kings for $60 and I wasn’t extremely serious about any breeding projects as I just wanted to get a feel for breeding and see if it was something I enjoyed and felt was worth doing, so far I’ve produced 4 clutches of Kings and as of now I’ve only made a teeny bit over $1k in the 5 years I’ve bred Kings… which is less that my total household weekly paycheck. All of that money was put back into enclosure improvements and buying general care stuff like food, cleaning supplies and bedding.
That doesn’t even come close to the total amount of money I put into my reptiles in the 16 years I’ve been in the hobby before I ever produces animals. Hell it doesn’t cross the amount I put into raising up that breeding pair I bought as babies.
And I actually lost one of my breeding Kingsnakes last year so I don’t really plan to breed more Kings until I can have better pairings lined up and raise up a good male to put him in place of the male I lost.
That puts me back a bit outside of breeding Ball Pythons, which I still don’t expect to make a whole lot of money off of anyway, and the total worth of that BP breeding trio is around $1,100.
So I suggest you really think about what you’re wanting to do and why you want to do it.
There aren’t a whole lot of “beginner” species when it comes to breeding. Getting reptiles to a point where they are ready to breed in of itself takes effort and care.
The Kingsnakes I mentioned I would not personally consider “beginner” breeders. They are cannibalistic and very aggressive while breeding so they have to be monitored in person constantly while they are together and when they are finally locked they can be locked for hours. Then when the mother lays theres always a chance for her to eat her own eggs, then there’s no guarantee that all of the eggs will survive incubation and no guarantee whether or not all of the offspring will eat and thrive. Some of those things apply to a lot of reptile species.
And all of that doesn’t even cover the fact that you are not guaranteed to make any sales of the offspring for at least a few years. It took 2 years for me to sell my first snake.
As I already said to @noodlehaus , I know not to expect profit. also at this moment I am leaning towards Rhino rat snakes ( still not 100% sure and I still need to do more research) as from the little bit of information I saw on breeding them they don’t seem to complicated, (still, I’m going to keep looking into it) and on a care level I’m sure I can handle it, although I’ll keep looking into it.
To make any money in breeding I would suggest a pair of beef or pork. $1000 won’t get far but you will sell offspring. If you really want a breeding pair (of something)to at least pay for themselves, try rats.
Apologies if that sounds snarky but profit should be the last reason to culture anything, especially as a hobbyist. @40 years in and rats are the only part of this hobby that has made me any $ and they usually just feed themselves.
So if I may ask, why do you want to breed? Because profit is really the only reason you’ve given, which is why people keep bringing it up. You also said you wanted to breed to “keep up with the hobby,” but I’m not quite sure what that means. You certainly don’t need to breed to be part of the hobby or to stay informed about the hobby, so I’m not sure what you’re trying to “keep up with” by breeding.
I’d personally take that 2k and put it in a money market account and ignore it for the next five years. Don’t get into a project to hopefully make a profit that you sustain whatever your trying to accomplish for the next five years.
If you read through some of the comments from other breeders here, you’ll notice that all of them said it took them years before they even came close to breaking even. So even your notion of breeding to have your hobby “pay for itself” is not terribly realistic. And it means that your primary goal with breeding is in fact making money.
And I’ll be honest, in my opinion, it is absolutely not your pets’ responsibility to pay for their own upkeep. If you can’t afford to keep reptiles, then you shouldn’t be keeping them, period.
Breeding adds even more expense. There’s all kinds of things you need for breeding that you don’t need to spend money on if you’re just keeping pets.
And the biggest potential expense is vet care. That’s an expense you should already be prepared to deal with, since you already have several animals, but the odds of needing vet care go up significantly if you breed. Are you able to get an animal to a vet quickly if something goes wrong? Are you willing and able to spend hundreds if not thousands of dollars on a single animal at a moment’s notice? Keep in mind that it’s entirely likely you’ll incur vet expenses long before you sell a single animal, so don’t count on sales to pay for your vet bills.
Gonna highlight this because what Jennifer is saying is very important:
I’m going to speak from personal experience. I’ve had almost $3000 in vet bills in my just over four years of keeping/breeding. I had a female end up egg bound and needing spayed twice, almost three times. I had a snake get caught in the lid of his enclosure and need x-rays and care. I had a male hognose develop fast moving kidney cancer who had to be euthanized. That hognose never bred, meaning I was out the money I spent on him, as well.
One other big thing I think you’ve overlooked is how much time and effort exactly go into keeping and breeding. You’re going to be cleaning, feeding, weighing, documenting, observing, handling animals so they’re socialized, all on a regular basis. You have to do social media, advertising, talking to customers, traveling to and from FedEx if you plan to ship, and more. Can you drive or will you need to rely on family to help you get places? I suspect you’re still young and in school, so this is all on top of whatever school, hanging out with friends, chores, and family commitments you already have.
this is a reply to @jawramik and @noodlehaus, I am homeschooled, and when I say “afford the hobby” I basically mean pay my parents back and eventually be able to get even more things for the reptiles that are either, better quality or bigger and better, and just to give them higher quality lives. And I know I’m probably not going to make profit for a while, but its going to take longer if I don’t start now.
Also you guys are really bashing me on this, and I don’t 100% know why so many people are commenting and only have bad things to say. tbh it make me want to quit morphmarket.
No one is bashing you whatsoever, we’re just trying to make sure you’re understanding the actual amount of time, money, and effort that is going to be required of you if you want to pursue breeding in earnest. You seem to not want to acknowledge that there are certain requirements to responsible breeding, and that you’re very likely to need to spend a lot more than $2000 to even start. You’re talking about getting animals to breed before you’ve even done the research, that almost never ends well.
Like the way we’re going about it or not, we are trying to help you be ready before you start breeding. You also need your parents 100% on board with any extra expenses or emergencies you may have beyond just the purchase price of your snakes and you haven’t even said if they would be willing to do that. Have you told them there could be unexpected expenses? Are they willing to help you get and pay for any vet care? If they are, great, go from there. Start researching species you want and how they’re bred. Don’t buy anything until you know what you want, and how they’re kept properly. Don’t start breeding until you’ve done all the research on that, what to look for in an ovulating female, appropriate mating behavior, risks, signs of and issues, every little bit of information you can possibly get. You can’t just jump in and expect things to work out.
Just because you don’t like the answers you are getting does not mean they’re bad things. Everyone here has been very clear. You will not be making money. That’s not how this works.
If you want something that can make you money right now, rats have been suggested. Otherwise try quail or chickens.
Reptiles are very expensive when it comes to veterinary care. You will also need to make sure you have a qualified vet in your area to even treat for any issues that pop up.
My favorite breeder male passed away unexpectedly last year from a sudden and severe infection. Because he was breeding multiple females, I had to have a necropsy and testing preformed to make sure my other snakes would be okay and also quarantine them from my other reptiles. The price for the vet service was 800$.
Will you be raising your own feeders for these animals? You also will need to keep in mind how much feeding will cost.
Have you worked out the caging situation for the breeders? How are you going to house the offspring?
You really need to budget all of this sort of thing out before you purchase. It’s not as easy as saying the animals are $1000. New caging for 20 animals recently cost me double that.
It’s not just important for the animals. This is also things you should be doing to prove to your parents that this is something you’re serious about.
It is very easy for everyone here to see your previous post about your gecko’s sudden death. If basic monitoring for routine activity is not something you could do reliably for a beginner species then you should really be focused on learning to care for a species and have them thrive. Will you be able to monitor these new animals for that proper behavior? Would you even know what behavior to look for in this uncommon species?
Everyone’s advice here is meant to help you improve on how you move forward. Everyone wants to make sure you aren’t here making another post about a sudden death, prolapsed hemipene or eggbinding. We want you here posting success stories about the animal.
The truth hurts but understanding it will make you a better keeper.
I’m sorry that you feel attacked, that was not the intention. Our concern is for the welfare of the animals, and also your own welfare. It’s going to be an awful time for all involved if you have a bad experience.
It’s admirable that you want to take more financial responsibility for your animals, but I still say there are much better ways to do that than breeding reptiles (which, once again, is only going to cost more money, it won’t be bringing in any cash). When I was in high school, I tutored junior high kids in English and played violin in a string quartet, and made a decent amount of money doing that. Those just happened to be my interests and talents, maybe give some thoughts to your own interests and talents and think of how you could monetize some of them.
If you have your heart set on breeding animals, something like feeder rodents and/or feeder insects (crickets, roaches, etc.) would probably be a much more viable revenue stream. And it would cost a whole lot less to get started, which means you could actually see some profit. Not as glamorous, I know, but much more doable, and you would be providing a very important and needed service to the wider reptile community by providing high-quality feeders.
I think everyone else has given great advice, so as a 22 year old who recently left the nest fully, I want to highlight this.
You seem to be pretty young, which causes some concerns for reptiles you buy down the line - my mom has taken over care of my herps since my apartment doesn’t allow pets (and MANY that allow typical pets don’t allow herps) - so the more animals you buy now, the more you need to have plans for when you eventually want to go to college/go to trade school/get a full time job and move out of your parent’s house.
Also, if you have access to 2k at your age, speaking as someone who has started adult life with nothing, it really would be best to save and invest that if you can.
I want herps SO BAD, I think about it every day - but I know I am in a position where I cannot provide care based on life situations and finances, and I know that money needs to go elsewhere right now.
I feel ya, if I could buy reptiles right now I would be going crazy - but a big part of growing into an adult is having to push back ‘wants’ in order to make sure you can fit everyone’s ‘needs’ - yours and the herps.
I agree with everyone else - breeding herps will be a net loss of revenue for a long time (maybe forever), you are young and should consider alternate plans especially while you are living at home with your parents as presumably a minor
I get what you’re trying to do/say.
When I was young I had I route of pet stores that I would visit regularly.
Some I would sell rodents to. Others I would breed different fish for. Some would want different food cultures like daphnia or brine shrimp. Some would buy plants. Money almost never changed hands but I never ran out of bedding/food/ heaters etc. The point is to have my hobby support my hobby. If there was a pair of anything that would have given me the same benefits, I would have had them. I never found them. Never will, I think.
You can do the same thing. Big box stores generally don’t purchase from small producers but if there are a few small non- corporate pet stores in your area you can inquire about doing the same. Perhaps a few dozen feeder guppies can be traded for mice. You could trade a decent bosmina culture to get your adult breeder fish.
Ask the owner what type of things they need regular supply of. Feeders of any type are a good side hustle whether insect, rodent, worm or fish.
Some tropical fish are in demand and can easily be propagated in a small space. Ram cichlids or kribensis come to mind. If you have a decent size yard some fish can be cultured in rubbermaid boxes outside. Then used as $ to acquire other stuff.
It’s basically the barter and trade system. I’m sure there are people on this forum that will have different hobby related stuff they would trade with such as sticks,stumps and leaves suitable for terrarium use.
Diverify.
