Hi all. I am getting a small, 160g Male Demeril’s Boa next week- if all goes well. Weather has not been cooperating. I have a slightly unique situation and question please…
My 4x2x2 is far too big for a juvenile Boa. I want to build out a smaller enclosure, inside the same, maybe using the rear corner, near the lighting/heat/b…since I have the lighting, heat, venting, etc. I have the HDPE material (plastic) and it is easy to fabricate (hot weld or fasten.) Glue does not work well with this stuff.
I was thinking to basically target 1/3 of the large enclosure and frame something out that is about 12" tall x 24", but I am wide open to any appreciated suggestions.
Do I need to put a lid on it? Most would scream YES, but it is already in the box so he can’t get out “OUT out.” If he was really curious, I suppose, he could scale the wall and explore the other territory. Not sure if that is a bad thing- if at some point he feels comfortable and brave enough to do so.
Will having a 24" ceiling be too high (lower where the light drops down by 6".) I do not want him to be uncomfortable, or feel over exposed.
The front, main side is clear, but he would have white plastic walls on 3 sides and plenty of substrate, leaf liter, etc.
Thanks!
Dumerils aren’t particularly shy.
As long as you have plenty of ground cover and multiple hides the bigger cage should be ok. In a 4x2x2 I would put in shelves for climbing rather than branches because dummy boas just aren’t the best climbers. They will but you’ll often hear or see them drop to the floor.
They are smart for snakes so make sure your cage is secure or you will find your friend wandering about possibly looking to eat your other pets. I have heard of them being picky eaters but that seems to be an exception. Mine never turn down food whether mice, rats or birds. They are known cannibals and lizards or other snakes are definitely on their menu.
They are quite slow growing but can reach 6 or 7 feet long in time.
They will also use their tail as a lure when hunting so if your snake comes out and greets you then flips its tail, check your feed record, it may be hungry. Mine do this quite often and it’s always a surprise. They aren’t stabby or bitey but rather assertive when it comes to interactions with people. Mine are, anyway.
They’re all quite similar in appearance but we will still need pics when he comes.
Reach out if you have any questions or concerns.
Happy herping.
1 Like
Thanks Gab. Great tip about shelves- maybe even ramps from the way you describe them- plop! Ouch.
My enclosure is very secure, but I can always improve. I do have a small dog so as the Boa grows, I will have to be extra vigilant.
Main question was about do I need to put a lid on top of the small box, I build out in the corner. Think of it as a hide of sorts…or can part of it remain open in case he wants to wonder. An expert said to never leave him alone in a big 4x2x2 as they don’t do well. He has bred Dummies for 40 years- very old school, so I mostly trust him…but I do also think he is set in his ways. Other methods can also work. He uses a tub with a lid. I had ordered one but then figured I already had it inside- using a corner, I just need two sides really.
Making a lid is more involved as I have lights and things that are sort of in the way overhead. Plus I want him to get good air flow and light from the halogen. He uses heat mats, one water bowl and Aspen- and done. Nothing more. He emphasized to keep it dry for dummies- not even a humid hide…
Thanks!
Dumerils will tolerate drier conditions than some but keep a humid hide for him to use during shed.
As far as heat, anything goes so long as it keeps an appropriate temp.
Having the heat source inside the cage can be very risky, however. If he climbs on/ into it, it may burn him. Personally I used cable set under the bin and run through a thermostat.
Your breeder friend is correct about spartan furnishings and your snake may not care as long as his needs are met. Ground cover will help with comfort levels when it comes to wandering about but know that, in the wild, they have fairly small home ranges and have been observed in the same place for months/years at a time.
If you go the bioactive route a few handfuls of hardwood leaves make great cover for him and the cuc. Make sure they are nontoxic and with minimal bugs. I use corn husks and lawn clippings, fresh, at times and the bugs really clean them up. You may want to stock pile a bag of leaves for over winter use. Keep a moist spot in the corner for your rolly pollys and cover with leaves. Btw, the clean up crew will likely eat the sheds and poops but the urates will still need to be picked up. If you can. Dumerils pee a lot and they tend to be moving when they do.
1 Like
Thank you for your comment. Lower humidity needs is one thing that really attracted me to a Dumeril. That and the fact that my state essentially prohibited my first choice- all the cool morphs anyway. I went from a 100 gram noodle that would not grow much, to a potentially future 8 foot monster and they are more comfortable with the latter. Go figure…but the dummies are really growing on me- especially the one I found and should be getting next week. He just ate- will ship about 5 days after…is that too soon? One breeder said 10 days after eating before he ships. I don’t want to open the box to a mess and that could stress him too.
I have an overhead lamp that will be 12-15" above him but it has a very solid wire mesh that even an adult could not damage. Very heavy gauge metal screwed in tight.
Yes, the breeder said they will mush over anything. He basically laughed at all my plans…in the nicest way. I am learning and open to all.
I bought a fancy Herpstat 2 Spyder with WiFi. Overkill but figured buy one and be done.
I just researched the 20 plants that do well in Madegascar. I still might put in a few for looks and semi-bioactive. Any tips on a CUC that can survive low humidty- not Isopods I don’t think. Did you elude to pill bugs and sow bugs? If so, TY!
I got leaf liter. Must have looked special but I went into the woods- away from any pesticides. He said NO to dirt, but there is dirt in Mad. And Leaf Liter and I think sand. I also got Coconut bricks that I can hydrate. Some said it works great.
Do I spot clean or how often must I do a whole sub. change, if I use semi-bio active. The tip I got was to use Potted Plants in Terracotta to avoid a moldy mess. Less of an issue now that I am going drying- more of an issue with Pythons and a humid set up I suppose.
Thanks for all your great tips! Much appreciated.
Last question…If I build out a small corner to he is not overwhelmed in the huge 4x2x2 (he is 160grams now), must I put a lid on it? I would prefer not. He cannot get out the bigger thing. If he wants to climb over the wall that will come up 12", he is welcome to explore but he can still take shelter in a roughly 12x24 smaller home spot.
1 Like
Shipping 5 days after a meal should be ok. You will probably open to a mess. 10 days would be better. Remember to leave him alone for at least a week, 2 would be better, to let him settle in. And 2 or 3 meals before you handle him.
As far as cleaning, it would be a good idea to keep him in a semi sterile environment for a couple months before moving to bio. Clean as necessary but keep disturbance to a minimum.This will allow him time to get used to you and his new home as well as let the bioactive gain some maturity.
For plants with an animal this size potential I would recommend plastic. They live longer and never need pruning or transplanting. If you go with live I’d suggest using cat litter pans. No drainage holes. Plant spider or pothos in it and they’ll take off if the light is correct and will double as a humid spot. Easy to remove/replace if need be.
1 Like
Great tips- thanks. So minimal. Just some Coconut fiber substrate. I will give him time to settle.
If I make a corner box, like 12"Wx24"Lx6"height, within the bigger (4x2x2) box must it have a lid? It can’t get out the bigger enclosure. Is it likely to scale a 12" wall and go into the main area? One breeder said they do not do well in 4x2x2 as juveniles. He is 160g now. Could fit in a measuring cup. I like open for ventilation, ability to get the above head light, etc.
Lastly, so leave the rest of the enclosure bare? It is white HDPE plastic. A bit slippy.
Using a corner as a cage within a cage is a good idea. You can open it to allow wandering and give him opportunity to explore then let him find his way back. A bedroom of sorts. Letting him explore the large cage will let him gain confidence in his new territory but you will want him to reside in the smaller mostly. Not unlike a pasture for a horse or a run for a dog. Look at main cage like a secure observation area.
Still I would give him a couple/few weeks in the small area to settle in then let him expand his new home.
Coco fibre is good stuff when it comes to bedding but feeding may cause some worry. I would use a clean plate, place his prize on it to avoid accidental ingestion. Hopefully he eats p/k or f/t.
Also, a white background is unusual in the wild and may cause stress for him. Not necessarily but consider how often they or any creature would encounter a monotone white environment. In a dim situation it shouldn’t cause problems but if lit up for plant growth it may hinder wandering during the day. Too bright= nervous behavior from feeling exposed. I use contact paper in my wood cages as a moisture barrier and it comes in a bunch of different colors and patterns. I use either clear or wood pattern. Might work to break up the white walls. I’m not saying a white environment will cause stress but it is unusual and it may help.
1 Like
Thanks for the amazing insights. It all makes sense. I am big on non-toxic things so I avoid contact paper because I read labels. I could have bought a PVC enclosure, but I read labels and made my own from HDPE (almost zero off-gassing- cutting boards are made of it.) I got white, because black HDPE has other things in it. Point taken though. At some point I will try to cover up some of it with plants or something- even dirt! I love the idea of considering nature- it’s common sense. Yes, never saw an all HDPE jungle in Madagascar…but then again, neither has he! I think people and critters can and do adapt to new environments over time. The front is also glass so he will see colors and things. I imagine he will spend most of his time, head down in sterilized leaf litter!
Great tip about the plate. I will try to incorporate that with feedings but when he grabs it from the tongs- not sure where he will take it. If he wraps it up, likely it will be off the ground.
I did not use any wood as I read about mold. Truth be told, all my amazing ideas and effort e.g., paying a lot for dual pane, insulated glass to trap heat (still valid) and humidity (mute) are less important- especially the latter as these guys do not need much humidity at all. The breeder basically laughed at me. Plans change. I originally planned to get a corn snake that would need all of that but I came to learn that, ironically, my state has them on the endangered list- most of the cooler morphs. I could not get any of the ones I really liked so I switched gears and landed on Dumerils boas- love the low humidity aspect. And ironically, my state has no issues with Boas that can grow to be huge! Go figure. Even they admitted it was not logical but change in govt. is often very slow. Their focus is not on the danger and scariness, but more conservation/endangered. I sort of get it now. And also Boas are not indigenous here therefor not endangered. This past month has been a learning experience to be sure. All these small tips add up and really help. Yours were great, and have been very much appreciated.
Thanks and Happy Holidays!