Hey guys, I hope everyone is doing well!
I just received two new snakes today, one of them being a late 2024 male super banana mojave from a breeder whom I’d consider to be a pretty reputable seller that seems to know their stuff. However, I was under the impression that super bananas don’t get the freckling that you see on single-gene banana/banana combos, but this guy definitely has freckles that were not visible in his display pictures. Looking into other super bananas at different stages of life, I’m not finding any that show that freckling either.
This is my first (alleged) super banana and I admittedly have not seen many in person, so although he does seem to have those softer colors you see on supers, I’m not wholly convinced that he’ll prove out and unfortunately a good bit of his appeal is that when paired to my BEL down the line they’d only produce banana or BEL combos. I don’t want to bring this up with the breeder though in the event that I’m just misinformed and super bananas do occasionally get this freckling… Any input would be appreciated!
2 Likes
Mind sharing photos of the BP in better lighting?(maybe outdoors at noon)
As well as photos with the snake’s body outstretched.
I only ask because looking at the photos you’ve shared already I’m not wholly convinced that this BP has Mojave, or maybe there is more going on. Looking at the pattern near the neck is whats telling me that, usually Mojave does not have chaining alien heads like that…
Also do you know the pairing info for this little one?
3 Likes
Are these a bit better? Hard to get him to stretch out very well rn, he’s very stressed and rather spicy after transit.
I did message the seller asking if they remembered what pairing produced him, but haven’t gotten a response yet.
2 Likes
I would be interested to know the pairing that produced him as well. He’s at the very least banana mojave, but his pattern doesn’t match with just that (and super banana if he is a super would change the color, not the pattern). He has head fading that suggests maybe pastel or a fire complex morph. As for whether he’s a super banana, probably the best thing to do would be a shed test.
4 Likes
Definitely something more than Mojave banana going on from the look of it…
For comparison here’s a photo taken just now, my 2019 coral glow Mojave. Even as a single gene she doesn’t have any spots on her because of how Mojave interacts. Her daughter is a hypo cg special that does have spots.
5 Likes
Still waiting to hear back from the breeder, but the more I look it over I can definitely agree the patterning seems off for just a (super) banana mojave. Even if you throw pastel or fire into the mix, those results don’t seem to match up either with the mojave seeming to maintain a cleaner pattern when those are present, where this guy is pretty busy. There’s the area towards the end of his tail too where it almost looks like some sort of paradoxing of the pattern and gets a bit of a granite look to it, but in his display pictures on the seller’s site that area just looked really light/blushed out.
But that being said, you think even with the freckling it’s still possible he could be a super banana? My original question was mainly about that since it was my understanding that supers just don’t get the freckles period. I’d definitely do a genetic test if it’s still a possibility, but I’m on the fence on whether to keep him or return him. I do think he’s still a really pretty snake and wouldn’t necessarily mind keeping him, but if his genetics aren’t what he was advertised as then I’m not sure I should.
3 Likes
Agreed!
Your girl is absolutely gorgeous, and the difference between her and my little guy is glaring. Suppose I should have taken notice of that before pulling the trigger on him, but with how light he looked in his ad photo and the fact that I’ve bought from this breeder in the past without issue or question, I really didn’t think too hard on it until I saw him in person and noticed the freckling. 
2 Likes
Based on what I’m seeing when comparing on MorphMarket, I think it’s likely he’s not a super banana. I can see how the breeder would have thought that given his coloring, but he is gaining spots and from what I can see super banana adults have no spots at all (or if they have spots, they’re a much lighter color). I can’t say for sure but I think it’s likely he’s just single gene banana with some other genes at play.
As for whether you should or shouldn’t keep him - my advice would be to bring up your concerns with the seller and see what they say. It’s possible they might offer you a partial refund, or a different animal in exchange - or they may say you’re wrong and stand by their ID. I would get in touch with them and go from there, personally. If you were wanting a certain set of genes, it’s reasonable to return an animal for not having those genes. Either way he has some stuff genetically going on that the seller isn’t aware of or didn’t ID properly.
5 Likes
Looking at the tail end in the last photo you sent shows some very interesting pattern, I really want to say that there is paradox going on there. Its so subtle of a difference but I definitely see it.
But yeah I still stand by what I thought, I don’t see Mojave in this guy unless its being masked by another gene. Definitely get in touch with the breeder about all of this.
4 Likes
I noticed that on him as well! In the ad picture, that area just looked really light/blushed out but I can definitely see how the patterning in that area gets way busier and is subtly off color from the rest of him. A mystery for sure!
It’ll be a real bummer if he doesn’t have mojave, as I can deal with him not being a super banana (though that’s a bit of a letdown too), but I bought him to ideally pair with my super lesser paradox gal down the road to have a banana/BEL making pair. I shot the breeder an email with some pictures, hopefully I get a reply back soon. I’ll be sure to update if they can tell me what the genetics were of the pairing he came from, hopefully that will shed more light on what’s going on with him!
3 Likes
Annnd update!
Breeder replied saying the pairing was a banana leopard Mojave to a banana butter - perhaps the leopard could explain the busier patterning and/or the “paradox” spot? 
Though I’m really hoping that indeed means he’s still a Mojave and not actually butter/lesser, since I want to make Mojave x lesser BELs rather than super lesser BELs.
In regards to the freckles, they said they have a handful of male supers that apparently do have some and are still confident in their identification. I’m willing to give the benefit of a doubt and see what happens when I pair him down the line, but in the meantime if I get a little extra cash I think I’ll run some shed tests on him beforehand just to be sure.
2 Likes
I’m going to be honest, knowing that lesser is in the pairing, lesser represents his weird pattern much better than mojave (though it still doesn’t match completely). If we’re guessing between lesser and mojave, my bet would definitely be on the latter. Mojave leopard is possible, but it’s not the look I would expect with the way he presents phenotypically.
Ultimately, if you’re interested in breeding this guy down the line I would definitely recommend shed genetic testing, both for lesser vs. mojave as well as for banana/super banana. Super lesser BELs can have pretty severe bug eyes.
2 Likes
That was kind of my line of thinking, too. Out of everything I’d like to check for in a shed test, confirming whether he’s Mojave or lesser (if either) would be the most important to me and why I mentioned wanting to avoid making super lesser BELs. No bug eyes for me, please!
If it is lesser, then I’ll probably either find somewhere else to fit him in future plans or just keep him as a pretty pet. I do have a GHI pastave gal he could possibly make pretty babies with, but she’s currently engaged with my sterling ghost for ghi ghost mojaves. 
If it turns out he is in fact not a super banana like we’ve speculated here, I can live with that, but I’ll definitely be keeping it in mind before dealing with or recommending this seller again.
Whenever I get around to getting a shed test done on him, should I update here?
1 Like
Yeah… I’m fairly sure with that pairing you have a butter leopard banana.
He is still pretty light colored for that pattern so there is maybe a chance that the super banana can’t fully deter spots because of the leopard gene. They are mostly very small spots from what it looks like and I would expect more at that size.
With most super bananas I’ve seen if they do have freckles they’re usually dark tan or light purple and blend in fairly well to the background colors. But a lot of them are just not very noticeable.
Would definitely be interested in knowing what the test results are if you get them. Still a great looking snake.
1 Like
Fingers crossed that isn’t the case, I’ve been browsing other animals posted on MM with those genetics or a combination of (either with the single gene or super banana), he still looks so different from them that I just don’t know what to think anymore lol.
Looking at the genetic testing they offer here, it doesn’t seem like they have one for banana/super banana right now, but I can run a panel for mojave, lesser/butter, and leopard at least.
I’ll definitely share the results once I get him tested. Now just to hold out for a good shed…
1 Like
