This is big for me. I am really excited to be adding these to my collection. The first snake I kept (not something wild caught for a few days) as a kid was a northern pine snake. I had to rehome him with my high school football coach/science teacher when I went off to college. That snake is what drew me to working with bulls and I’ve been wanting to get some pines back in my collection, but I can’t keep northern pines in NC because they are a protected native species.
Today I was able to acquire an unrelated pair of ‘22 Black Pines (P.m. lodingi) produced by Michael Coone. These aren’t directly from Michael even though he bred them, but from someone else in NC so I was able to avoid the interstate commerce permit that is required for purchasing/shipping these across state lines.
I feel very fortunate to have the opportunity to keep this species going in the hobby. Michael works really hard to ensure his bloodlines are our and genetically diverse because there are so few of these around. I plan to continue that work with this pair.
The female is a total teddy bear. Still working on a name for her. The male is total devil and already bit me during unboxing. He’s been named Black Phillip.
Congratulations! Those guys are fabulous! What an exciting project as well! This will bring a little variety to the community as you keep updating us on your new journey! I am excited for you and I wish you tremendous success!!!
Thanks! I couldn’t be more thrilled to have them in my collection.
I’ve been keeping in touch with the gentleman that bred them and I am getting a pair of Louisiana Pines (P.m. ruthveni) from him in September. Ruthveni are in a similar boat as the lodingi in that there is no wild blood entering the hobby due to their federal protection status. That coupled with unscrupulous folks crossing them with other pine sub-species, and with bullsnakes, have cut down on the number of pure lines available. It’s also created issues with genetic depression due to inbreeding.
I’m working on tracking down a line of FL pines (P.m. mugitis) produced by Giacomo Meeker that have a very light pattern with purple markings. They are beautiful.
As far as I can tell, Giacomo is no longer producing these and I haven’t found a way to contact him. I have found a few ppl that have animals from this line but they aren’t of breeding age yet. I’m okay waiting for them though because these are the FL Pines I really want.
Can’t own northern pines? No problem! I’ll just get the rest of the ssp.
You are certainly resourceful! The one in the first picture is awesome! I love the head shape of these guys! If hospitable they look like they would make great pets for keepers that want a strong, medium bodied intelligent?animal. They just look intelligent to me…….
So most of my bulls are easy to handle. I have one or two that are a little more high strung and sensitive to stimulus. They aren’t biters but they will get agitated and hiss (loudly), writhe about, and tail buzz. They can be very defensive as hatchlings but most of them grow out of that with a little work. The bull and pine defensive display is pretty iconic. The hiss is really more of a bellow or roar. It’s like they are roaring at you when they get going . I have heard that FL Pines can be one of the more high strung pituophis ssp but this probably varies a lot by individual.
That new male black pine with the attitude is going to take some work. He’s already two years old so it may be a case where he never calms down. He is coming from a gentleman with a large collection, so I’m not sure he has had a lot of hands on time. I’m going to give it some time to see how he settles in and if his behavior changes at all. He may just be a snake that needs to be kept in a rack to cut down on the amount of stimulus he is exposed to and handled only as needed.
Their look is awesome. I love the chonky heads/cheeks and the scowl. Those really pronounced ocular scales give them an intense look.
As far as “intelligence” goes, they are very in tune with what is going on around them. When I come in the room, I have ten little heads popping out of hides to watch me. I suspect that is more food driven than anything else - “The food man is here! Please food man, it has been 10-minutes since our last meal. We are starving! May we have more furry sustenance?”. Compared to the boas, who don’t seem to notice me until I open the cage, they are very tuned in.
For anyone looking for a snake with personality, an impressive size (but not huge), very hardy (not demanding husbandry requirements outside of cage size) and great eaters (these guys don’t turn down meals and their metabolisms are very fast), a pituophis species would be a great choice.
Great info on these unique individuals! Hopefully we will see an influx of new owners pop up here! Either way I am so excited as you are excited about this project @eorr53! This is a new journey for you and I can’t wait to see new babes! And I am willing to bet you will be successful at the “taming of the shrew”!
I really like all your bull snakes. It’s a very nice collection you have. I haven’t seen any around my area in years. But I really don’t go looking for them anymore. Use to catch them to release in my yard for chipmunk control. Works very well on them. Come to think of it, I do have a large colony of them this year in my yard. I just might have to go bull snake hunting this year or next year.
If I’m not mistaken, you are in an area with some nice dark ones like the kankakee locality in the hobby. One “hole” in my collection is a nice dark northern locale bull. The head and face markings are awesome. Like war paint. I’ll need to add some down the line.
The pine snakes are lovely. All of them, and your new pair is beautiful, @eorr53 ! If you’re still considering names for your unnamed sweety female, since you called her a teddy bear, may I suggest Theodora Ursa? Or even Ursa Theodora? Just a thought…
I like it! I almost just said Ursa. That was my first impulse. I went with the two names since the male is Black Philip which is kinda two names but not exactly. “Black Philip and Ursa” works well together!
Yes the keeled scales have a different texture than smooth scaled snakes. I think they look more matte, but not completely, than smooth scaled snakes also. Not the same sheen look.
