FADER... who knows it?

We are getting a DH pied & albino girl this weekend. The guy we are getting her from says possible fader that he is 90% sure she is fader but can’t sell her as. We are getting her for the hets. We know nothing of fader and I cannot find much about it. Any one got the scoop?

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Have just one animal. It’s a reducer and color enhancer.

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Is it a co-dom or is it kind of like paradox or ringers that just pop up randomly?

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Despite a decade of asking and looking, I have yet to see a “single-gene” Fader.

Myself and many others have long felt that this is a line-bred trait.

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I have a super stripe fader and can’t find anything on it to save my life either. All I can find is that NERD discovered it and they use it a lot in their odium line. I have reached out to nerd and never got an answer and there just isn’t much on it. So the way I see it, is its not proved to be incomplete dominant or recessive… so if someone could prove it out and have good evidence of such then that’s probably going to be real real good for them.

I’m going to be honest, I can’t see a single difference in any animal that is listed as Fader compared to the same genes without it. Hopefully someone can prove me wrong.

It may just be me :man_shrugging:t2: but I wouldn’t buy into it.

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I’d have to agree with Tom (@eaglereptiles). To me the snakes with “fader” present look the same as those with the same genes without “fader”. Not worth the investment in my opinion.

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@mnroyals and @eaglereptiles We happened accross a snake we purchased as a lesser het albino and when we bought her the guy gave us his receipt with her clutch ID on it. We happened to know the breeder fairly well and messaged him. Turns out she is a Black Pastel Yellowbelly Lesser pos fader het albino. Didn’t really intentionally buy into it but really didn’t know a lot about it. Which it seems no one does.

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You would want to try and contact Kevin from NERD. He would know the most about Fader, and whether or not your ball has it.
Mind sharing a picture of your snake in question?

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Trust me…it’s nothing! Don’t invest your money.

It was kind of a surprise possible gene we got in a snake we already have.

Working on uploading photos… We have tried to talk to Kevin before on different traits and we never could get the time of day from him. We know we can use traits from this girl but do we call her offspring pos fader or not even worry about mentioning it? That was out biggest thing.

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That’s up to you really. Personally I wouldn’t bother even saying it’s possible Fader. Can’t tell for sure if it’s carrying that mystery gene or not, and like @t_h_wyman mentioned, I don’t think anyone has ever seen a single gene Fader making it very questionable it’s even a gene and not a line bred trait.

And from those pictures I don’t see Black Pastel in your Lesser.

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I apologize, is pastel lesser yb het albino… thank you for catching me on that. I had to go look at her tub and in our record book.

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I think it reduces pattern. But nothing crazy it’s not co dom in my opinion. This is my female pastel yellowbelly fader.I would say it’s polygenic.

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So you think Fader shows it’s influence when mixed with certain genes?
That could explain why there is no single gene of Fader, that’s interesting to look at it that way.

Exactly! But I’m not geneticist lol. Just my humble opinion.

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I wish BLBC were still alive… I had a whole damn novel written on this… {sigh}

So… The short(er) rehash

“Fader” first appeared out of NERD in their Pastel animals. Around the same time, in the completely unrelated ‘Citrus’ Pastel line from independently imported founding stock, the “Whiteout” appeared. Also around the same time, also in the completely unrelated Graziani Pastel line from independently imported founding stock, the “Duper” appeared.

All of these first appeared in the superforms of each line. Over the course of a couple season, the single-gene forms from these lines began getting the label.

Now… What we have is either:

  • A) Three wholly independent and unrelated WC founder stock lines that all had some secret gene hidden in them which magically expressed itself in all three lines all at the same time
  • B) The constant selective pressure for higher-blush, higher-contrast animals by the founders of those lines, who all got them around the same time, resulted in a similar (but not identical, because of different selective criteria by each founder) polygenetic phenotype being expressed among all the different lines.

The founders of two of those lines, when breeding their trait exhibiting Pastel animals to non-Pastel animals, recognized that the trait basically disappeared. The third founder bred his trait exhibiting Pastel animals with another morph, that he had also been selectively breeding for high blushing and contrast. Unsurprisingly, the offspring from that also displayed high blushing and contrast. And from this, it was decided that a new secret gene/morph had been hidden in the original Pastel animal.

We no longer see animals being sold and carrying “Duper” or “Whiteout”… But we still see “Fader” (or poss “Fader” or "from a poss “Fader” or "might also be “Fader” or…)

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That’s really odd and a coincidence of events. Thank you for sharing that. Definitely going to benefit the community some more to go off of because this Fader whatever it is, is hard to get any info on.
I do remember the Whiteout, but don’t recall Duper.
From that analysis, I would go with the conclusion that it is polygenic, and closely with Pastel it seems.
Thanks Dr. Wyman, appreciation as always.

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