I agree with @caron
Dumerils are fantastic starter ‘big’ snakes with a lot of personality and that perfect balance of chill and curious. My male is just barely under 6ft which isn’t unmanageable at all but he still looks big. They generally have a calm and moderately forgiving disposition, their wild type pattern is beautiful, and they aren’t thousands of dollars. you could go bigger if you choose a female, probably somewhere around 7ft and thicker, and still the final caging requirements aren’t going to be very demanding. Though you could certainly spoil them if you chose to.
Super dwarf retics are highly intelligent and moderately energetic for a large python species (even tho sd’s are tiny in comparison they’re still retics with big snake brains so in terms of behavior i still count them with the anacondas burms and full size retics.)
This is to say that they will need more space and enrichment and positive interaction than similarly sized species to keep their brains working in a positive direction and avoid depression. They give less obvious warning before lunging and they are very food motivated. Therefore the ability to read snake behavior is pretty darn handy with them. And you do have to be sure what you are buying is a real 4th gen sd retic as some people aren’t very honest when selling dwarfs and making that mistake on a purchase is going to leave you with a very different animal as far as required experience and commitment goes. As long as you are ready and prepared to dedicate that extra time, space, money, and research to them, sd retics are awesome! As you said no snake is a bad beginner snake as long as you can dedicate to it. (Except true giants, arboreals, and hots.)
If i were you i would ask myself how much money i could reasonably put into an enclosure. How much money i would like to invest into the animal, and how much time i can reliably dedicate to said animal per day. Then i would ask myself which of the two has the disposition I’m looking for. And i would make my decision off of that.
Oh if boas are your ideal then go boa all the way. The majority of my collection consists of boas. I have anywhere from your locality dwarf to your common boa to your bcc. I also know multiple people who started out with boas. They are fantastic beginner snakes if you are already versed in the community, which you are. I would start with a male if you are concerned. Adult males get big but not huge. I can understand your concern with being bit. I’ve been bit by my 5’ male and it certainly wasn’t awesome. But it was one of those situations where in retrospect it was easy enough to see how i could have prevented it. Therefore in theory, if you don’t go sticking your hand into their enclosure on feeding day, and generally learn from your mistakes, you’ll be fine. And i have no scarring from the incident so it still didn’t turn out to be all that bad in the end.
Compared to Dumerils boas, bci are a bit more cantankerous in my experience. But they are both generally pretty chill. Dumerils are still going to need less space overall than common boas. My male Dumerils can thrive in a 6x2 for the rest of his life whereas my bci male is going to be in more of an 8x2 as an adult. (Keep in mind that the minimums are not what i use and most people keep Dumerils in 4x2 and bci in 6x2 but you can make your own decisions on how much extra space you want your animals to have.)
Honestly, either choice would be good and it would once again come down to how much money and space you can dedicate to your animal.
Thank you! I’ll start doing some research into Dumerils so I can compare it to the BCI info I’ve found already!
Having a smaller (but still large size) snake would allow me to really spoil it in terms of home environment, which I really enjoy the thought of.
A generally chill smaller boa species that I can spoil with the space/cage requirements for a much larger species sounds ideal actually, thank you!
Hog Island boas are also smaller than BCI/BCC Boas, but I hear they are quite similar in many respects- could be worth looking into. Still big boas, but not quite AS big.
I also have aspirations to have both a boa and an sd retic. I’ve decided to go for the boa first, because most people I’ve talked to seem to agree that boas are a little easier to keep than retics overall, and that boas are an ideal introduction to keeping larger snakes. Now, if you didn’t have any real interest in having a boa, then I’d suggest just going for the retic, because I dislike the notion of taking in a living, breathing, feeling creature for the sole purpose of being able “practice” for the species you actually want (such “practice pets” often end up neglected or worse, since the keeper didn’t really want it in the first place). But since it sounds like you’re into both boas and retics, I think getting a boa first would be a good idea. Then maybe you can get a retic a little further down the line, and then you’ll have two big, awesome snakes to enjoy.
This sounds perfect!
The whole reason I started this thread was because my interest in medium snakes like bulls and rats is there, but its not as strong as my passion for boas, and I didn’t want to treat any animal like a ‘starter’ if going with a smaller snake first wasn’t the recommendation from more experienced hobbyists.
Everyone here has given such great advice and it makes me way more confident I’ll be able to make the right choice for myself and my animal when the time comes to choose one
@jawramik Well said regarding the “practice”pets! All animals deserve a loving caring home and human/humans no matter whether they came first, second, third, etc.!
Honestly, they are my true recommendation to you. They are really incredible animal. They are strong, very strong for their size but they are very gentle also. To me, there is nothing like a boa.
Agreed. Never owned a corn snake but hear nothing but great stuff about them. Boas to me are some of the most confident, accepting, curious snakes on the market. If i had gotten into boas prior to bps i would have probably have far fewer than 27 bps and far more than 2 boa sigmas. BCIs with some great morphs are still on the list once i have a larger home. (36 snakes, 6 rodent colonies in a 760sq ft studio, gotta keep em under 8ft for now. No room for larger housing set ups)
As someone who just came from a very similar living situation i must say i am truly floored by your abilities to fit that many animals into that small of a space. Granted i do have number of boas, regardless i was struggling to adequately fit 12 snakes into my space and still have room for living in. Your power is truly on another level.
Its definitely become a lifestyle instead of a hobby or a job. Definitely need more space so i can expand my rodent colonies. I need to become rodent independent. Its going to take 12 colonies plus grow out enclosures for me to not have to rely on others and guarantee i have what i need for all my huggie worms. It can run as high as $400 a month if i buy feeders locally. I dont mind doing that. But a one grand investment and $100 a month in food and substrate is more idea for me. Just need the space. If i lay in bed with my head at the foot of my bed i can reach over and touch my rodent enclosures. Lol. Hopefully one more year and i can retire from working the bar biz on Bourbon st, move out of the French Quarter and get a more appropriate living scenario.
Do you find the rodent colonies are stinky/do you have them outside of your home? I work in a rodent lab so I know that the smell with large numbers of them can become…a lot, if their bedding isn’t changed every 3 days or so
My snakes get the kitchen half of the apt. The other half is my living/sleeping area. My rodents run down the wall across from my sofa/lounge area and sleeping area at the foot of my bed. Mice are by far the worst. By day 5 their enclosure start to smell like decomposition. My single colony of mice smells worse than my two rat and three asf colonies combined. My mice i strip down weekly. My asf and rats i change bedding weekly, spray their pee corner with probiotic enzymes, and strip down monthly. And honestly, based entirely on my snakes behaviors i will probably always keep my rodents and snakes together. I find it makes every species i keep more active, curious, and totally disinterested in me. I keep ball pythons, blood pythons, kingsnakes, boa sigma, and bullsnakes. I havent been tagged since unboxing my blood pythons in sept 2021. Only ever been tagged 4 times and 3 of those were during unboxing/inspecting new arrivals. Not that i would recommend others do the same, but it works for me.
Not to change the topic of the original post, @nolagregg is correct on cost of breeding feeders. When I had 16 bins of rats (gone up since them), it cost me $100 a month to support them and not a lot of time per week. And at the amount of rats produced, I was able to sell off most and have free feeders for my own. So it does pay to breed your own. But, the smell, space, and time and finding a buyer are all big issues. If you don’t have the space, time or a buyer then you will become over ran with rats and cleaning falls behind then the smell gets worse. It is a job in itself.
I would disagree with this. Carpets are a fine starter species, so long as you have done your homework up front. I would strongly suggest bredli as they are nearly bombproof and most of them, once they realize it is not food time, are very personable
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This statement
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Pituophis have a winter brumation period where they need to be off feed
Fact of the matter is that most all snakes are going to have/need some kind of seasonal feed break. So if this is something that concerns you I would strongly advocate that, rather than eliminate a species because of this trait, use it as one more point to educate yourself on to help you become a better keeper
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I would agree with this, Dums are a great starter for a big snake.
