You’ve definitely taken the right first steps. Hopefully the fluids jumpstart it’s metabolism and get things moving. I would communicate this with the breeder and show them the photos as well. That animal should not have lost that much body mass in that amount of time unless it was highly stressed and even that’s questionable in just six weeks.
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Ya I’m hoping the same, that fluids help get him going again. And that the blood work will help narrow down what may be the cause.
As for communicating with seller. I’ve messaged seller 3 times in the last week to no response.
First 2 were regarding his previous setup temps and humidity and weightloss to no response 3rd was yesterday telling him I taking him to a vet. No response.
He has replied to me 3 times since I recieved (I’ve probably sent 10 messages in total since receiving)
Once when I said I recieved him
Once 2 weeks later when he had refused 2 meals in a row to ask what size he was eating
And once more 2 weeks later when I wanted to discuss his feeding tactics like how he held it and how long he held in front of him and what time of day he fed. And also ask what his cage setup was like that’s when I was told he was on newspaper.
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Thanks for clarifying the fluids lol, Because then I won’t be as nervous about that lump on the side. Definitely a good thing to get bloodwork done and starting on antibiotics in the meantime
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I doubt you will hear anything from the seller, but of course I am the cynical one around here. You are certainly doing the right thing by your animal and fingers crossed that the bloodwork will show something that’s easily treatable. Be sure to keep the updates coming……. 
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Heres a photo that better shows what I was referring to about him looking flat.
Also he has peed (urated?) since coming home from vet.
Not sure what to make of that. Thinking likely from stress from today…
Has not moved since I put him in… Definitely lethargic. And they did tell me they did not have to use any sedation to him today during his appointment.
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The peeing is from the fluids so that’s normal. He still looks dehydrated to me but I am sure the vet will recommend more fluids if needed. If you don’t see him use the hide you might try something else that just kinda sits on top of him, that doesn’t take up so much room. But in any case he is going to be a lot better off with everything you are doing for him so great job! It’s sometimes very difficult to care for a sick animal ………
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Honestly I’d suggest taking that hide out with as flat as he is looking right now. With him not wanting to move, it is taking up too much space and not allowing him to rest in a relaxed position. Maybe find something temporary that is smaller but he can be flat under or on top of, like a cardboard box with a large archway cut out or something.
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Yeah definitely pull the hide so it can be in a resting position.
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I would get rid of that hide. Just cover the tub with a towel.
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Any update on this guy?
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Yes just heard from vet.
Hi Jake,
I wanted to touch base about Sundragon’s test results - I’m emailing because I have some recommendations I thought it would be nice to have written down, but if you want to chat on the phone we can absolutely do that as well.
Overall the bloodwork is not very exciting. He is a little dehydrated (which we already knew), but other than that nothing is outside of a normal reference range for his species.
While it is good news that there isn’t anything obvious on his bloodwork, I am still quite worried about him and I am concerned there is something going on that we are missing. Unfortuatnely, reptiles can be quite challenging sometimes when they prevent with vague signs.
At his age, I do worry about the potential for congenital or viral diseases, in addition to occult respiratory disease.
How is he doing currently? Any improvement after his visit? Any more wheezing?
If you are noticing more wheezing or any nasal discharge I would like to continue the antibiotics I started him on on Thursday.
From a diagnostic standpoint, I think the best next thing to do would be to take x-rays ($316) to look for evidence of respiratory disease, or any other abnormlaities. Another thing to consider would be viral testing (which is quite expensive and we have to send samples out to the University of Florida).
Things to do in the meantime:
- I would like you to soak him in a warm water bath for ten minutes daily to help re-hydrate him.
- Increase his humidity to at least 60% and provide him with a humid hid box.
- While he is sick, i would also like youto increas his basking spot to the high 90s.
- Since he showed interest in the live mouse but got bit, I would like you to try and offer him a live pinky - they can’t hurt him but they still move which may convince him to eat.
To which I replied
Thankyou for taking the time to type this up.
Totally understand the mixed feelings about the bloodtest.
I will say Saturday evening and Sunday he seemed to be a bit more attentive when I checked on him. He turned and looked directly at me. And he has been moving about a bit more. I haven’t seen him drinking but I’m trying to only briefly check on him 3 times a day to minimize stress.
I have not heard anymore wheezing either. Nor seen nasal discharge or star gazing.
He did urate shortly after getting home on Thursday. Figured that was from the fluids/potentially a bit of stress from Thursday.
I will proceed with warm soaks, and increased humidity, as well as attempt a live pinky rat feeding (should I try this ASAP? Or wait until it’s been a week since last attempt. Also if he takes one, since it’s so small for him how long till I offer another?)
I do want to ask about your suggestion to increase temp, other breeders I’ve been in contact with said I should perhaps lower temps a bit to slow down his metabolism so he stops loosing weight. If you still think mid high 90s I’ll go with that.
Xrays… Tbh ay this point with bloodwork showing nothing, my thought is that it might be crypto or some other parasite. Unless I’m confused and those would have shown in bloodwork, but from my understanding I’d need to do fecal tests. I am curious if you know if fecal crypto tests can be done on urates or not (since he’s not eating I don’t have any actual poop to test and not sure when I might.)
Also curious if lack of appatite can be a symptom of crypto.
I do think more sub q fluids and antibiotics would be helpful as they seemed to boost his energy even if only slightly.
I’m curious if that’s something I can buy from you and administer myself to save some costs.
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Tldr
Bloodtests didn’t tell us anything other then dehydrated
Vet suggests xrays or viral testing
Vet suggest warm baths daily along with increased humidity and temp.
My end update
He’s a bit more active and alert since getting fluids
Have been checking on him very briefly 2-3 times a day.
I’d like to get him more sub q fluids and antibiotics to administer my self.
I will be trying a live rat pinky/pup to feed tmrw likely ( open to suggestions on timing last attempt was last Thursday)
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Sq fluids on a snake can be very difficult to give without assistance. It can cause a lot of stress as well since it’s uncomfortable for them to get. And if he takes well to the soaks, not really required in the long run.
Antibiotics on the other hand can be easier to give by yourself. And are not as stressful.
I definitely think the virals would be important to check. Especially if you to have any other snakes, but will also help to know if this was something he was sent to you with.
I’m glad he’s a bit more alert for you! Hopefully you can get more answers soon. Keeping my fingers crossed for the little guy.
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And @murdocksreptiles What about the vet suggested higher temp Christina?
Also @murdocksreptiles did you remove the huge hide? Your critter will be a lot more comfortable I believe……
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It might be worth trying to get your hands on some Davinci boa supplement for the soaks. Most people that use it swear by it. @tommccarthy may have some other ideas to help with that, he’s been keeping boas a long time.
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I don’t want to go against vet recommendations… Having the higher hot spot can cause the metabolism to stay up, so on one hand, the antibiotics can can work faster…and his weight can also drop faster if he still isn’t eating.
The antibiotics right now are definitely something we want to work.
@ballornothing may have more insight on it.
I do think the snake should be kept on the higher end of the ambient temps for sure so he doesn’t get too cool again.
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It’s definitely a balance. Hotter spot could possibly help with the issues but it could also contribute to further weight loss. “Raise the temperature” has been the default suggestion for sick snakes for all of time, but I don’t know if the vet is saying that from a position of experience or because they’ve heard it a million times.
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Yes large hide has been removed. Has not been replaced with anything but the entire tub stays covered with a towel.
Temps have been increased by a few degrees but now I’m torn on wether to bump them back down or not.
He’s currently in a soak right now around 98degree water.
I will look into the supplement mentioned! Thankyou for that tip.
I’ve been continuing to try to contact seller. Very disappointed to say I can’t get any form of response out of him.
Last two messages have said
"Hey man. I’m taking this sundragon to an exotics vet tomorrow. He has lost 10% of his body weight in the month I’ve had him.
He still won’t eat. I’ve tried frozen thawed fresh kill and live both rats and mice. I’m really starting to worry about him you can see his ribs…
I’ve never had this happen. But Im worried he’s not going to make it…"
&
" Hey man I want to ask you. Can you absolutely assure me 100% that this boa had been eating healthy and fine before I recieved him, that he ate a large rat 2-3 weeks before you sent him? If so and this weight loss is really this drastic since his last meal then I think I may have to euthanize just due to not wanting to infect my other boas.
If he hadn’t been eating for longer and he’s just on food strike for a couple months before you sent the that’s crucial information I need from you right now. "
No response…
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Another update.
My weight tracking has shown that his weight has increased since his vet visit on Thursday.
1398 snake weight 4/2
1350 snake weight 4/27
1270 snake weight 5/7
1312 snake weight 5/13
Now I’m sure the subq fluids were most of that but I will be doing nightly weight on him after his nightly soak for the next couple weeks in hopes of seeing an increase
Still curious thoughts on live rat pinky and when I should offer. Last offered a live adult mouse on Thursday.
Also looked into DaVinci boa supplement.
The directions say “Mix with food or inject dead feeder with formula before feeding: 0.1ml/cc for every 100g of body weight. For an animal that is not feeding or suffering from metabolic bone disease, give once per week until feeding resumes or symptoms resolve. For regular maintenance give once a month as a supportive animal health supplement.”
A little vague on how to give when not feeding. Do I dropper it into his mouth? Or is that why you were saying to use during soaks and to just add a bit to the water??
How much should I add to 1gallon of water? Want to make sure I’m getting enough for a couple weeks at least.
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I’ll let the folks with more info give you the advice on feeding and enclosure temps but I had to pop in to say something about this particular point:
Honestly this sounds way too hot to me, but I’ll tag @ballornothing just to be sure. It’s one thing to bump the temp on a basking spot but the animal can’t regulate temperature in a soak and 98ºF is up near temperatures that can actually start causing harm, at least from what I know.
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