Who exactly would enforce these laws? Social workers? Pretty sure New York has cop shortage.
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I wish this was true. There are plenty of people in government who want to help push green policies problem is there arenât enough of them. And that goes for both sides of the fence. I mean we are all still driving internal combustion engines running off of fossil fuels save for a few! Kinda been doing that like a 100 years. If we truly had more green thinking members in the government that wouldnât be the case.
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People at places like Fedex would be told they do not accept the shipping of live animals anymore. If anyone were to bring in a snake or something they would simply deny them service. If the worker doesnât deny service then they would be likely be fired.
Hi everyone
Firstly I would like to state that I am from South Africa, so I will just speak to what is happening over here, which might shed some light on this topic and also maybe create some understanding.
By understanding, I mean what bills like these in the US would mean to you as a reptile keeper.
So as stated above, Iâm from South Africa, where the regulations on Reptiles and basically all animals are heavily regulated.
To give you an idea, my country is about half the size of Texas with 9 provinces/districs. 1 of these, you require permits for ALL animals except cats and dogs and some birds.
Another province requires permits for all snake species that could be invasive, now I say could be, according to the law on this side, itâs everything.
The other provinces are okay to keep snakes, except for travelling of these animals to and from the above two provinces you require a travel permit.
On the issue of permits - itâs Africa, so itâs Africa time, which means this can take minimum 4 weeks and up to a year.
To give a full list of illegal animals in our country would take me a year, but I will give an overview:
1.Ferrets or any related species are illegal - apparently we have feral populations running wildâŚthis is absolute bull shhhhâŚnone have ever been caught.
2. All Amphibians
3. All aligators or crocodiles, caaymans etc.
4. All freshwater fish that could become invasive.
5. All turtles and tortoises.
This all started with bills like the ones you are facing now, travel bans on animals, restrictions as to what you can keep etc.
Try and fight it, over here we not only lost the battle but the war. The wonderful animals that you can keep, we never canâŚ
Do I understand what invasive species can do, yes of course I do, our government introduced insects into a dam to eat the hyasinths in the dam, now the insects have taken over and our indigenous insects are suffering, and the hyasinths are still there.
I personally feel that as a responsible keeper of animals, we should be allowed to keep and travel with our animals. Governments are quick to issue fines and confiscate animals, but only of the keepers who actually look after their animals, not the ones who are releasing unwanted pets in the wild.
Apologies for the long post, but it is an issue that is close to my heart and I really have sympathy for you guys in the States.
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Banning any species for no reason would be far more dangerous than any pandemic!
Please tell people about this!
This is incredibly dangerous!
These thoughts should not be allowed!
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I suspect that nearly everyone in the reptile hobby/industry can agree that it is very annoying when lawmakers, who may or may not be well-intentioned, conflate conservation issues with issues related to keeping exotics as pets. While there is some overlap there, because nearly all of our animals are captive bred these days, in reality we are talking about 2 essentially separate issues: conservation of wildlife & the keeping and breeding of non-domesticated animals. Iâd suggest that those of us involved in the hobby/industry try to avoid conflating these issues as well.
With respect to conservation, wild animals are part of our shared natural heritage, and thus, they belong to everyone, or no-one, depending on how you see it. Governments, therefore, not only have the right to craft and enact legislation to protect wildlife, they have a solemn duty to do so. Those of us who love animals should be 100% behind legislation that protects wildlife so that future generation get to enjoy it as well. That is not to say we should support legislation or legislators who make well-intentioned but uninformed decisions that negatively affect our hobby or livelihoods.
Which brings me to the second issue⌠laws and regulations regarding the keeping of âexoticâ pets. So long as we are talking about the exchange and sale of captive bred and born herps, I am personally 100% against regulation of any kind. So, obviously a person can be a dyed-in-the-wool conservationist and an avid proponent of keeping herps!
It may interest some of you to know that I recently had conversations with several SC legislators regarding the bill that is set to be enacted here in my state. Representatives from both sides of the political divide were actually quite receptive to hearing me out regarding how the broad language of the bill as it currently stands would have unintended negative effects on hobbyists and small businesses. Not to mention that the law would effectively make my 9-year daughter a criminal for possessing a Corn Snake! The bill was intended to stop the poaching of wild SC reptiles (primarily turtles) that end up being sold in Asian wet markets and also to curtail the use of SC as a corridor for the trafficking of illegal wildlife products (e.g., bear gall bladders). Hopefully we all agree that those things are not cool! To their credit, the responses to my argument that âenacting a law in SC, similar to the one in Georgia, would infringe on the rights of South Caroliniansâ was to inform me that the Dept. of Natural Resources had already discussed these very issues and would be issuing âexemptionsâ for several species of interest to the pet trade. Fingers crossed that actually happens.
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Well watch out New York! They went ahead and banned our tegus and iguanas and many more!!! Hopefully USARK can try to fight this somehow.
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Agreed. Much can be improved within this and pretty much all industries, but broad overreach is not good. The assembly person that presented this bill is notoriously anti-pet industry. She is only supportive of rescues and is heavily influenced by the Humane Society of the United States. Her basis of knowledge is the issues of disease in response to the pandemic and the highly publicized issue of day old poultry that died during shipping via USPS during the onset of Covid when the mail service was over-run and unable to meet deliveries. Other than poultry I donât know of any animals that are ever shipped via USPS. I barely trust them to deliver my mail, much less an animal. Iâve been shipping animals for over 10 years and in that time only ever had one issue with a delayed packed with FedEx.
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One thing to keep in mind is that, Florida has an invasive problem with Burmese Pythons because theyâre an apex predator, thereâs nothing stopping it. But, with ball pythons I donât think they can become as invasive since they will be eaten by several top predators. Ball pythons donât lay as many eggs average (4-6) and theyâre not as aggressive as Burmese pythons. If anything, ball pythons could possibly lower the rat population. Theyâll have a small variety prey available to them, limiting thier chance of exploding in population. Whereâs as Burmese pythons have wide variety of prey they can eat, ranging from small prey, birds, fish, gators, deer, etc. So we should consider the science before rushing to conclusion. Iâm no expert but I can clearly see that Ball Pythons will not be has problematic at becoming an evasive species like the Burmese pythons.
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There are plenty of small native species that are at risk as it is. Any invasive species, no matter the size, can pose a larger threat than most would think. In the wild, ball pythons are actually known to lay a lot more eggs than in captivity. Any invasive species is bad news, and should not be looked at as if it is insignificant.
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Unfortunately that sort of mentality is why we have so many invasive species. It is impossible to predict what will happen, and most times the result is way more destruction to native animals and habitat than anyone could foresee. Just look at purposefully introduced species⌠the story is the same everytime.
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Economic impact:
Saltwater recreational fishing: 9.2 billion*
Saltwater and freshwater recreational fishing combined- $11.5 billion*
Supports: 88,501* (saltwater only)
Supports: 106,000 jobs* (saltwater and freshwater combined)
source: https://myfwc.com/conservation/value/saltwater-fishing
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So roughly Florida makes 2.3 billion on freshwater fishing alone.
Thanks for sharing that link.
Obviously way more than what they bring in on reptile fees from shows each year. But I think anyone with common sense knew that.
Appreciate it.
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Of course this is my state 
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Yes the money the state makes on fishing. Well since it was brought up the peacock bass is a South American fish purposely introduced for sport fishing. Tilapia of various species another introduced group of fish introduced by the state. Letâs not forget the other bottom feeders they brought in to â clean up â like the different species of armored catfish like the brown hoplo. Common fancy guppies and mollies introduced to help eat mosquitoes. Itâs kind of strange itâs to protect and conserve them they do way more damage themselves. Letâs not forget that earlier I mentioned how they tried to hide the new crap laws down here in the hunting and fishing regulations. We will over look the countless feral pigs I see everyday driving to work or the cane toads they thought were a good idea.
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If there was suddenly a statewide ban on shipping all reptiles what would happen to the mom n pop pet shops out there? Theyâd most likely shutdown since they get the majority of animals via mail. That means places where we purchase feeders and supplies (heat bulbs, etc) might shutdown.
Personally if they ban shipping and later ban ownership of all reptiles theyâd have to come to my home and take my animals by force. Oh and I always have my Glock close by so careful with breaking the door down and startling me lolâŚSome of us Vets are on way to many meds to stay still and let someone take our âkidsâ which for me are actually comfort animals that help me cope with certain issues.
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Think that is the goal
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While this may be the case, I donât feel we should be adding intentionally or unintentionally any animals into an already fragile ecosystem. Anytime your adding any non native species into any ecosystem you are throwing off the balance. I wish all the efforts that are put into banning animals and importing animals was focused on restoring our ecosystems. And preventing destruction of the remaining wildlife areas we have. Stop letting them chop down forests and building on them. Letâs save what we have left and work on regrowing our ecosystems.
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Ball pythons may be eaten by larger predators, but that doesnât stop them from becoming invasive.
Take brown anoles and cuban night anoles for example.
Both are invasive, but cuban night anoles prey on both green and brown anoles, but brown anoles have adapted and figured out ways to avoid being eaten.
Same thing can happen with any potential invasive species.
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