All of them have been. Blackhead spiders, blackhead champs and blackhead hgw have been proven to be allelic. Thus all of them have to sit on the same locus.
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@owalreptiles Ok sable and chocolate were proven allelic by bailey and bailey reptiles a long time ago. But these are not listed but spotnose and chocolate are. I’m not understanding why that is?
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I’ve never been presented proof of it.
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@owalreptiles That’s understandable I’m just surprised given the age of the morphs And the number of times the combo has been made. If the information isn’t provided you can’t accept it as fact.
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If the proofs out there I’m all ears, it’s not a refusal of acceptance. I have a complete absence of evidence. If you would of told me a few years ago enchi and black pastel were allelic, I’d say the same thing. There was zero public proof of any trails to show it. Despite both morphs being around forever and combos being made forever also. I’m not sure what your asking of me, if there’s proof, link me to it.
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@owalreptiles Never said you refused to accept anything. My point was I’m surprised the proof hasn’t already been presented. Given there’s not a lot of people that actively work with sable anymore I doubt that many of these breedings will take place to document it. I’m not in the least trying to come off as cross or argumentative. So I apologize if that’s the way it seems.
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I know about the ringers. It’s one of the things that drew me to champagne in the first place. But the breeder said they where all het pied. Can’t wait till my girls are ready to breed. Hopefully the first one next year.
Het pied may not be what’s causing the pied look. Even normal champagnes can look full blown pied. I have no evidence besides my own experiences to back this up. But seems to me the black eyed Lucy and 8 ball complex have a higher tendency to throw ringers and pied look. Neither of these two have het pied and both appear pied.
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ok so i have made several clutches over the years of champagne spotnose combos. They do have a wobble. None of them had issues eating or thriving. I didn’t have any with 2 different colored eyes, that i recall.
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@wreckroomsnakes What did they look like? Never seen one? Do you have any pictures would love to see them!
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Thank you for this addition. The most beautifull ones where indeed cinnamon champagne and black pastel champagne combo’s.
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@lindasark Your female is super nice! Super orange dream champagne is a smoking combo to! I think whichever route you go with your gal she will make some amazing babies!
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I’m now getting very curious if there is any correlation between champagne and mismatching eyes like champagne and ringers, or that it is a total random thing and people had that with all types of genes. And is there a correlation with wobble ( in case it’s more in the spider gene complex). I would be happy to hear from others, so I made a new topic about it. I don’t want to steal your topic so hope you don’t see it like that. You just got me so curious and if Justin had two of them…and all are champagne…
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@wreckroomsnakes Man the one with the ringer is nice!!! 
super nice clutch
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This one is a proven Firefly Spotnose Champagne. She showed zero wobble until she produced her first clutch.
I believe it is the combo of the leopard spotnose champange that is causing the 2 different colored eyes.
I produced a clutch of perigons (spotnose champagne) but i can’t seem to find those pics
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You may be right! Champagne and the 8 ball complex clutches are what I usually produce the most of. I know Champagnes seem to have a lot of variance in eye color.
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Actually looking back is misread it as I wasn’t accepting it as fact. My mistake. I apologize.
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Interestingly it seems from my breedings so far that Spotnose and Blackhead are not allelic…
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@kinova Would you say that sable is allelic to spotnose and chocolate in your opinion/experience?
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